Episode 42 - GenX Speaks Series: Sherri Dindal - The Real Slim Sherri Artwork

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GenX Adulting Podcast

Episode 42 - GenX Speaks Series: Sherri Dindal - The Real Slim Sherri

July 30, 2025 • Brian & Nicole • Season 1 • Episode 42

In this episode we welcome Sherri Dindal, aka The Real Slim Sherri. Sherri reflects on her “typical GenX childhood”, that was filled with being feral, drinking from the garden hose and even having her own Hansel and Gretel situation in her neighborhood. A home life that involved alcoholism and the factors that typically go along with it resulted in Sherri acquiring the hypervigilance that so many GenXers have battled their entire lives. We discuss the parenting styles of GenX as parents, and how many are breaking the cycle. Sherri shares how she has been finding success in the use of EMDR Therapy on her healing journey. We discuss how perimenopause may have played a role in Sherri’s decision to leave her job as an investigator at 43, but how that decision changed the entire trajectory of her life. Together, Sherri and her wife Christa started their first business, Feather & Vine boutique, ten years ago. Their second business, Wholesome Hippy soon followed, and has resulted in so much success that Sherri was recently on Good Morning America! Sherri shares how turning 50 was an awakening for her and another pivotal moment in her life. We learn how a severe battle with Covid led to her third business, The Real Slim Sherri, where she has gained over 6 million followers through her brilliant ability to use humor when discussing even the most taboo subjects, combined with an authenticity that brings comfort to her fans. The Real Slim Sherri led to The GenX Takeover tour, a comedy variety show that she headlines along with three other GenX talents, Kelly Manno, The Dad Bod Veteran and Mr. Professor318. The Millennials are also represented by host/comedian Justin Rupple. The GenX Takeover Tour is the perfect example of "you can do anything at any age" and the importance of conquering your fear of being uncomfortable while continuing to challenge yourself. It’s no wonder Sherri recently won the Cheer of the Year Award at the Cheer Choice Awards. The award is given to someone who has done good in the world and helped others, and what an absolutely eloquent honor for all of GenX that someone from our generation, who has a shared story with us, and who had the courage to take a leap of faith midlife to chase her dreams, dreams that ended up helping people, won. Many call her “The GenX Queen”, and as much as Sherri so obviously appreciates everything she has and how much she adores her fans, there is no question that being a wife to Christa and a mother to her son and two daughters is the pride of her life. We were absolutely thrilled to have this time with Sherri and not only hear her story, but discuss real issues that are affecting GenXers midlife. Even if you’re not GenX, you will thoroughly enjoy every minute of this episode, and younger generations will learn a lot.

Find Sherri At:
http://www.therealslimsherri.com/
ttps://genxtakeover.com/
https://www.tiktok.com/@therealslimsherri?lang=en
https://www.instagram.com/therealslimsherri/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCVOgGTmi_fT96aPcOoRQ6w
https://www.facebook.com/sherri.dindal/
https://substack.com/@therealslimsherri?utm_source=user-menu

Check us out at genxadulting.com

#generationx #genx #podcast #marriage #relationship #interview #mom #family

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[MUSIC]Welcome to GenX Adulting.Today we have Sheri Dendle,who listeners probably better know her asthe real slim Sheri inthe studio. Welcome Sheri.Thanks for having me. It's good to be here.We're thrilled to have you here.Our first question is always,what year were you born?1972, man. It was a good year.It was a good year.Yes, you're GenX.Yeah, right in the middle, right smack.Everybody's like,there's all these microgens,where they're like,"Oh, I straddlethis gen and that gen,I'm right in the middle."I'm right smack in the middle with GenX.I'm not the oldest of GenX,I'm not the youngest,I'm the middle child of GenX.We also are, we're 1971.Another good year, right?Also, right in the middle.No, it's nice to be able to claim,we are GenX. There is no zennial,there is no GenerationJones for us. We are it.I said, those micros,I'm dead in the middle.You cannot argue that I'm GenX.I mean, I'll getpeople occasionally be like,"Are you sure you're not a boomer?"I'm like, really?Oh my goodness.Absolutely not.Where were you born?I was born in Ohio, Finley, Ohio.Tiny little town. It's not as tiny as it,it used to be, butjust a small town in Ohio,the Midwest, Bible Belt.But I didn't, I spentprobably about seven yearsof my life there and thengrew up the rest of my youth.I spent in the city in Toledo, Ohio,which is north, right on theborder of Ohio and Michigan.Now, were your parents from Finley?My dad was from Finley.My mom was from Akron, Ohio.Okay.And so, obviously,they met wherever theymet and she moved to Finley.But yeah, originally she was from Akron,but she was born inWest Virginia, actually.My dad was born and raised in Finley.Where in West Virginia?My mom was born in Charleston.Okay.Brian's, his dad is fromMorgantown, Granville area.Yeah, I know where that is.Yeah. That's so funny.A lot of people don't know Granville.They know Morgantown.I know Morgantown.Yeah, I know Morgantown.Granville's right across the river.Okay.He looks from the Coliseum like,whatever direction it is to the river,Granville's right there.So you grew up there?You grew up almost there?My dad grew up there.I actually spent a lot oftime there in the summers,all through my childhood,even through college, I would go back.We go back every now and then.It's beautiful.It's nice.No, it's beautiful there.I spent a lot of time there as a kid too,visiting my great-grandmotherand my mom's family down there.We would go down in the summers as welland spend time in the mountains.The rivers and it's just beautiful there.Really is.Absolutely.Rivers and mountains.Yeah, it's amazing.Do you know how your parents met?Not really.They probably should havenever met, to be honest.I don't know how they met.I should know that story.Both my parents were still alive.I guess I should maybe askone of them at some point,but no, I'm not sure how they met,but they did.Okay, so they met and they moved to Finley.Well, you had already lived there.My mom.Okay, your mom moved to Finley.They got married.Yep.And were you the oldest?I am the, of my parents, I amthe only child that they had.I have an olderhalf-brother from my mother.My mother was married, had a husbandbefore she met my father.So my oldest half-brother.And then my dad, aftermy parents got divorced,he got remarried and Ihave a younger half-brother,but I'm the only child, buttechnically the middle child.Okay, and what are the years,the distances and agesbetween the boys for you?So my older brother and Iare about two and a half yearsapart.My younger brother and I,there's 13 years between us.Okay.So when your parents got married,you and your older brotherwere pretty close in age.Did you guys jive at first?Oh yeah, we were really close.And yeah, we, you know, wehad a pretty crazy childhood,I guess you would say.So, you know, we were pretty close.We relied on each other.How long were your parents married?I don't know.I was seven or so when theygot divorced, close to eight.So they were to bemarried maybe nine or 10 years,I guess, in total counting, you know,my mom being pregnant with me.And then I think they had been togethernot maybe a year before she got pregnant.So yeah.And during those years,did you experience thattypical Gen X childhoodwhere you were gone during the dayand no one knew where youwere until the nighttime?I think that that's like a standard.You can't be Gen X if you didn't.I mean, I can't say you can'tbe, but most Gen Xers, yeah.We were feral.We ran around.Nobody, I mean, my momlocked us out of the house.Like we were kicked out, get out, you know,we were locked out of the house.We, I can remembervery, very young, you know,the house we lived in when Iwas around four or five yearsold, my brother and Ibeing blocks away on our bikesat that age, you know,in the, I don't know why,but I have this memory.I don't have a lot ofmemories from my childhood.They're kind of sporadic and crazybecause I had a chaotic childhood,but I can remember mybrother and I going to this,this woman that lived acouple of streets awayhad a candy store inthe front of her house.And we were like in her house buying candyand looking back on like,this is like some old mother Hubbard shit.Or like, or like the woman who, you know,like Hansel and Gretel, thatlady, like she could have put us,she could have cooked usor some shit, you know?Like we should, we didn'thave belong in her housebuying candy.It was all, but we, weplayed on the railroad tracksand you know, we played in the creeksand we did, we did all thecrazy wild shit, you know,drank from the hose.We had, that was my, thatwas my upbringing very much.And were you with neighborhood kidsor was it mainly just you?Okay, so it's like a group of you.Yeah, there was a group that my,I think most of thekids at that, at that age,were all being locked out of the house.I think it might, maybeit was like a standardin the neighborhood oflike lock your kids outand we all ran together, yeah.Or we would go fromhouse to house, you know,we would go from place to place.We had a couple of friends who,their moms didn't lock them out.You were low.I remember one friend had,they had like a, looking back,I mean, I didn't know at the time,it's probably like a,what do they call them?A Casita where you havelike a mother-in-law suite.That's like a separate house out back.They had like a separate house, you know?And we would go out there and playand that's where we,that's where we hung out.You know, we would hang out there.Nobody ever checked on us.And then, you know, Imean, we, we wanted to eat.If we scrounged up somequarters out of the couch,we'd go down to theLawson's and buy some candyor some shit, you know, ormaybe a Slurpee, but yeah,we were, we were wild and feral.Yeah, I think that's definitely oneof the shared experiencesmost of us Gen Xers have.And it always shocks me, eventhough I hear it repeatedly,it still shocks meevery time because you thinkabout all the things that could havehappened to all of us.And as parents, we know now.And I sometimes, Idon't know if you rememberthat Tom and Jerry cartoonwhere they're watching the babyand no matter what happensto the baby is always okayand they're killingthemselves trying to save the baby,but the baby's fine.Sometimes I think some, wewere, we were just floatingthrough and somehowokay with all these thingsthat could have happenedto us, you know, I don't, I-I think that, I think asadults now we look back and go,I think a lot of usovercompensated as parents of like,I will never, my, youknow, that would never,I'm never gonna let my kid do that, right?Cause we did really crazywild things that nobody,they don't even know that we did.Like I still haven'tadmitted some things to my parents.So I think there's alittle bit of that of like,we were determined to makesure our kids didn't havethat type of a childhood.But then as adults, we alsokind of come to this realizationof like, how could somebodylet us just be free and feraland wild like that?And this is, but then thisis why we had kids on the sideof milk cartons, you know,this, this is why, you know,we had so many missing kids.And I think that, you know,in hindsight, you know, we,like I said, as adultscan look back and go,that won't be my kids experience.And now there's a lot more stranger danger.We had a little bit of that.Yeah, a little bit.Our parents would tellyou, don't talk to strangers,take candy from strangers, right?Stay away from white panel vans.Those are like the standards.But yeah, like it was like,you told me not to take candyfrom strangers, but youdidn't tell me I couldn't goin some lady's house andgive her money for candy.Like she could have beena predator looking backand nobody knew, they didn'teven know we were in the housebecause nobody knew where we were.They didn't, they didn't,as long as you were homeand looking back,that's so crazy to think likeyou would leave thehouse early in the morningand then you wouldn't come homeuntil the street lights came on.And if you, I think about those parentswho had kids go missingand think, well, your kidjust didn't come home whenthe street lights came on.And at what point do yougo, like they're missing?You know, I thinkabout that process of like,did you wait until the next day?They didn't come home tofigure out they were missingbecause we were gone forhours already, literally hours.Gone.It's not like now wherelike if a child goes missing,you typically know where they arewithin some shorterwindow of time, you know,but this is probably why most of those kidson the milk carton were never found.Yeah, I agree.I mean, we've had some listeners commentthat their parents would lookfor them after a couple daysbecause their parents assumedthat they were spendingthe night at a friend'sand they were, they were, but what about,you do wonder when thekids who went missing,was it a couple days beforeor a day before those parents?I've always kind of wondered like how did,at what point did you go there, you know,they're not coming back, atwhat point did that happen?And it's, you know, itdefinitely made me as a parentmuch more, I'm veryprotective of my childrenand I have three kids.And so I think about myfirst one, who's my oldest,you know, he'll be 36 this year.So I think of my oldest andhow I raised him, you know,he was a little, he had alittle bit of that feralbecause it was still the 90s, you know,so it was a little bitdifferent, but you know,people, it's funny tome how people were like,oh, it's, but the world isso much more dangerous now.I'm like, but is it, is itreally that much more dangerousor is it just that we'remore aware of the dangerbecause you have this kind of24 seven media in your face,news channels andsocial and everything is likean instantaneous headline.We didn't have that.You either caught theshit on the six o'clock newsor you read thenewspaper, if you were luckyand everything else waskind of word of mouth.And so you look back at the eighties,specifically theeighties and early nineties,crime rates were attheir highest, you know,they were literally attheir highest for violent crime,violent crimes.Those are down significantly.And so I'm like, I don'treally know that it was any,that it was a safer time.I think we were just not asaware and, and, and, you know,it wasn't in our lens like it is today.And so that made me avery overprotective parentof my younger ones, but my oldest,he did still get alittle bit of the benefitof not having this constant, you know,fear mongering with this, with the mediathat keeps it in your face.So my girls, they're,they can't leave the yardwithout me knowing.Yeah, yeah, no, I thinkit makes sense though,because how could we notbe so hyper aware when,as you said, we'reconstantly consuming what's going onevery second around the world.So as the reaction to that,not just us trying to create the childhoodthat we always wanted andbe the people that we needed,but the reaction to justsocial media consumptionand then 24 hour, 24 seven news cycle,what do you expect usto be like as parents?You know, I think theway we parent part of itis the reaction to all of that,because it scares the shit out of us.Well, yeah, I mean, wouldthey rather the oppositeof us to parents?Could you imagine in this day and age,if we parented kidstoday with all that we knowand with media in our face the way it isand the news and all thestuff that, like you said,around the world that we're aware of,if we parented our kids like we wereparented in this time,what that would look like.Yeah.It would look like wewere the shittiest parentson the planet.We would go to jail.You go to jail today for neglect,for endangering yourchildren, for whatever.Nobody gave a shit about that at the time.And I don't know aquestion that sometimes like is itbecause they weren't aware,they didn't have thatknowledge or did they not care?I don't really know.I don't know if they paid attentionbecause how fucked up isit that when we were kidsand you're eating yourshitty sugar-laden cerealwith the milk carton of amissing kid right there, right?I remember reading thatthinking what happened?So it was there, theparents kind of had an idea,but I don't know if they evercorrected or changed, right?That is the question oflike, did they not care?Were they, so to your point,the milk carton right is in their face,but were they reallyabsorbing that information?Were they looking at it going,were they wondering the same thing we were,we're sitting there eating our honeycombs,looking at this kid's faceon the side of the milk cartongoing, wonder what thefuck happened to him?Like I don't know if they were doing that,but I also think that part of it was,and I try never to talk negativelyabout any other generation.I intentionally try not to do that.So this is not a dig at our parentsor either the boomers or silent gens,but the boomers specifically,very self-centered andnarcissistic generationthat were very much me, me, me.And so there's some of me that wonders toowas just the sign of the times.Like everybody was just for themselvesand kids were sort of like an expectation.You have to have kids.Everybody has to havekids, you get married,you get a job, you worktill you die and you have kids,that's your job, that'swhat society expects of you.And so they had kidsthat they didn't maybenecessarily really want.And so in some cases, I think some of us,and I'm not sayingthat that's my experience,I'm just saying maybe some,and maybe it was my experience.I don't know, I'm still working on it,I'm still in therapy for that.But that maybe we weren't really wanted.We were just sort of in the way.Yeah, I think that's a really good point.I think you can onlyclaim ignorance so much.And I do think there are peoplethat shouldn't be parents in general.And I think back in thattime, women especially,I would not have beensupported to make that decision.That really has just shownup in the last, strongly,I wanna say in the last five to 10 yearswhere if a woman says I'mnot gonna have children,people are like, oh,okay, it's not a big deal.But back then, I thinkpeople would have said,what do you mean you'renot gonna have children?That's what you do.Like you just said, you getmarried and have children.And they married them young.It was like an expectation.Like you gotta find a man.You have to findsomebody to take care of you.You have to havechildren, secure everything.You wanna secure your future.Somebody to take careof you when you're old.Like all these sort oflike expectations of the worldof like who they were andwhat they were to become.And so I do think a lot of them,they were kind of in that whole free love,the 60s and they justwanted to just be themselves.And I think that'sbeautiful until they decided,I have to get married andsettle down and have kids.And I don't think a lotof them really wanted it.It was also the expectations of the church.It was the expectations of their families.And now you just mentioned somethingand I don't get into anything too crazy.But talking about likethe last five or 10 yearsand how now it's not as big of a deal,but now we're startingto turn back a little bitbecause now birth rates are down.And so now all of asudden you get a shit againabout whether women are having kids.And so like make up your mind.You either don't givea shit if we have kids.It's not an expectation.Or you absolutely, it's an expectationthat every woman puts out at least one kidso we can keep this machine runningbecause that's the money maker, right?Yeah.I don't usually talk about stuff like that,but when you look at it,it's like kind of fucked up.We started to fix things where maybe womenhad a little bit more ability to choose.Do I wanna have a kid?Do I not wanna have a kid?Do I wanna get married?Do I not wanna get married?To now we're back to, hey, we're declining.Our numbers are declining.So yeah, you gotta have kids.No, I think it's a really good point.Just as Gen X swung the pendulum as parentsand went completely theopposite of how we were raised.And maybe sometimes alittle too helicoptery,but so what?That's again, thereaction to many variables.I think to write that expectation of womento get married and raise children,women are swinging thependulum to the opposite of that.And now you want it to come back.Well, there has to be balance.And not like you said, notto go too deep into that,but I'm hoping for the Gen Z women,and I see it happening,that they are going tohave higher standards,higher expectations,and hopefully the GenZ men will rise to it.Because if they wanna have these families,they're going to need to,at least from my experience.Do you see us get to aplace of like you have kids,you choose to havechildren because you want to.Yes. I think that'sthe difference is that alot of people, unfortunately,and especially if youlive in an area where maybethe more low incomeneighborhoods tend to be,there tend to be morechildren in those environments,and that's a byproduct of that.And those kids,unfortunately, they're gonna have,a lot of them will havemore difficult upbringings,and that's unfortunate.But I would love to see us get to a placewhere you have kids because you want to.Because the last thing,what I despise is peoplewho have kids and don't really want them.And the only people whosuffer are the kids for them.The kids. Yeah.The kids suffer.100%, and I think that brings it back to,I think there were many boomers,we're talking the Woodstock generation,and then it was like--You love, man!(laughing)You need to go into a box,and you need to havethese children and raise,and so, I mean, you think about it,not just was there the commercial,do you know where your children are,that would come on at10 p.m. to remind them,do you know where your children are?But there was a commercial, Ithink a few years before that,that was all about haveyou hugged your child today?Oh, I remember that, yeah.Yes, and I think--That's the one, if you listen to the,what's being said in thatcommercial, it is gut wrenching.I'm like, I can't believethat we, this was our life.But this is what they were putting out,and I think that was to counter abuse,more than just--Well, yeah.We would view it as,oh, we need to remember,because of course wedon't abuse our children,we need to remember togive them a little extra love,maybe, for theirself-esteem, their confidence,whatever they need.Back then it was just, don't hit your kid,hug them instead.What was fascinating?I'm sorry, go ahead.No, go ahead, go ahead.So if you listen to thelittle, the kids that are in that,like that, I think if we'retalking about the same one,there's like a mom who'supset, the dad's upset,the kid's like, I don'tknow what I did wrong,and they're like makingexcuses for the parents of daddyhad a long day at work, youknow, mommy is stressed out,like they're makingexcuses, they were making excusesfor their behavior andfor abusing their children,for hitting their children.And so, and it wasn't,it's not like discipline.We're not talking about discipline,we're talking about hittingkids for all kinds of shit.Yeah, yeah.As an outlet.Dysfunctional.Yes, as an outlet.Because, you know,whatever, they did something,a minor mistake that was--You know what's crazy to me though,is it wasn't the parents thatwere watching it, it was us.We were the ones that werethe consumers of this thinking,oh, it's okay, that dad should--You mean the commercial?Yeah, it's all right, guys.It's not just that shit.No, it's so true.I think Gen X, we are the first generationto be gas lit as a whole,because every time we showedany emotion or concernor needs, we were gas lit,like completelyundermined, completely belittled.And so we all grew up, andwe'll get deeper into this,but grew up grinding.Oh yeah, we're stillgrinding, what are you talking about?We're still grinding.But, and again, when we get to midlife,we'll go on this further,but I think that it's just now,where we're kind oflike, wait a minute, we can--We're waking up, we'rehitting this phase of lifewhere you start, and I'mactually, we can get into it,I'm writing a book about that very thing.But it's, you know, when youtalk about the gas lighting,we still gas, we'restill gas lighting ourselves.We gas lightourselves, we were taught that.And a live product of that was Apathy.And we are just, we, you know,we became a very apathetic generation,a generation that kindof took on the mantra of,you can't, we don'tcare, you can't hurt us,we don't give a fuck about anything.That's a facade, that's a mask.And we learned to wearthat very, very young.And that was a result of conditioning,that was a result ofcompliance and obedienceand all the things that we were taught,which was, you stop that crying,I'll give you something to cry about.You know, it was go toyour room if you're gonna cry,self isolation even, westill self isolate a lot of us.Because we were not taught healthy waysof managing our emotions.And so we just stuffed themdown, we've pushed them down.And so usually if you see, I usually,I make jokes about it,but I try to, my content,I take serious topics andI infuse humor into themin a way to give peoplesomething to think aboutor maybe see things in a different way.But I've talked about, youknow, how our generation,you know, the whole self isolation,the shoving our emotionsdown, you know, masking,that if you see a Gen Xergetting upset about something,get the fuck out of the way.Because we don't, we were not,and I don't say this as like a joke,it's like pretty seriousthat we were not taughthealthy ways of coping with big emotions.Because we weren'tallowed to have big emotions.Big emotions would get met with disciplineor that wasn't evendiscipline, it was just punishment.And so we learned thatemotion equaled punishmentor emotion equaled isolation, you know.And so when you startpeeling those layers offand you start looking deeper, you're like,I don't, I don't process big emotionsbecause I don't fucking know how.Those were during our fundamentaland foundational years of our life.And we were kind of stunted there.And so I also jokeabout how we're just kind ofperpetually adolescent.Well, that's a joke, we gotPeter Pan Syndrome people,but it's because we, a lotof us were very emotionallystunted during those fundamentaland foundational years of our life.And so here we are as midlife adults going,I don't know what to do with this.What's remarkable to me is you're spot on.You're an absolute expert in this.I'm not an expert in anything.Just hearing you talk about it,you are absolutely spot on.No, 100%.It's amazing.100%.We were never taught how to identifyeven what emotion we're feeling.No one said, you'refeeling anxious because of thisand that's okay, Isometimes feel anxious too.This is what you can doto deal with your anxietyor you're feeling depressedand this could be the reason.It's boys and girls,especially the boys though.Like I think some of us girls had a look.Well, boys weren'tallowed to, boys don't cry.Boys don't cry and sometimes--Boys don't show emotion.No, and then, yeah.They gaslight, back tothe gaslighting ourselves,we still gaslight ourselves.It is what you're talking aboutis when I am feeling anything.We gaslight ourselves into going, I'm okay.Everything's fine.Shove it down, shove it down.I'll be okay becausethat's how we've always been.That's how we've gone through life.That's how we have gotten to where we areis just by shutting everything else outbecause we generally can'teven manage our own emotions,let alone anybody else's.So we're just apathetic toeverybody else's emotionsbecause I don't even knowhow to process my own shit.Get away from me, I can't handle your shit.And so I find myself,especially with two girls,one is 14, one is about to be 12.So I am on the ride in thestruggle bus, let me tell you,is looking at them going,I struggle to manage their big emotionsbecause I don't know how to manage mine.And so I'm like, my only response is,your crazy's gonna meet minebecause I don't knowhow else to deal with you.But I don't want tocope with them that way.I want to be a better parent.I want to be able to manage.And so I'm having towork through my own stuffto figure out how tomanage my own big emotionsso that I can be a better parentand teach them to havegood coping mechanismsand good ways of dealingwith their own emotionsso that they can bebetter people in the future.And this is what a lot of Gen X parentsI think struggle with.And so you have two kinds of Gen Xers.You have the one that you're talking about,the helicopter the shit out of their kidsand overcompensate it.And then you have theones that never changedand they're exactly like their parents.They raised their kidsexactly the way they were raised.And so you're seeingthis reflection of thatin these younger millennials and the Gen Zswhere they're like, you have two sides.They either absolutelylove their Gen X parentsor they fucking hate them.Yes, yes.I'm always surprisedwhen we'll hear from peoplewho say that their Gen X parents areexactly like boomers.And they'll say GenXers are just like boomers.And I'm thinking, we aren't, but it's--Because there's two types.There really are two kinds.And I didn't really realize it until,and now almost four years making content.And I see the comments, I read it.I can pick them out very, very quickly.The ones that are still,they didn't break the cycle.They didn't break thatgenerational abuse cycle.I wonder if there's a thirdbecause I almost feel likeI'm in that third in thatbecause on a continuum, Ifeel like I'm in the middle.Well, there could be a hybrid of the two.Habits, but trying to--You were born in 1971.Yeah, maybe.I think there could be a little hybridof one that's like stillhas a little bit of that.Because there are people,especially if you're an olderGen Xer, like almost GenJones, they're kind of, I joke,but it's not really,they're kind of boomer light.So they've got a lot of boomer tendencies,but they also are Gen Xers that have a lotof Gen X tendencies.So there could be likea hybrid, but I think--It's a struggle.Yeah, I think this is--You don't want a helicopter too much,but you also don't wantto be completely devoidof understanding and support.And I find it fascinating.How many kids do you guys have?We have three.So we have a 28 year old, a 24 year old,and then we have a 15 year old.He was our surprise baby.Bonus baby.And when you said, I'mactually laughing insidebecause he'scharacterizing himself as in the middleof the road, but hetracks our kids constantly,even our 28 year old.On the GPS on the life 360.Yeah, but I don't tell them.No, they don't matter.They all know that.There's a time our daughter was--Your helicoptering behind a curtain,that's all you're doing.Yes. Probably, yeah.When he wants to know all the goings onsand he hears us talking,he's like, what's happening?He wants to know everything.So--But I want him to figuresome shit out on the ramp.Yeah, yeah.You don't want to solve every problem.You want to bring some tough love,wherever that may fall.Yeah.So here's a question for the two of you.I'm curious.I was an investigator for a long time,so my brain works inreally wild, curious ways.Because this is yourpodcast, I'm asking you questions.As parents that parent together,how do you parent differently in that way?Are you more of a morehelicoptery and more protectiveand you're more behind the scenes,still protective,helicoptering from a distance with,I wonder because I'mquestioning if it's maybe a maleperspective versus thefemale mother perspectiveversus mom, I'mwondering if that's maybe that.So you see two parents together,what is your take on that dynamic?Yeah.So because your dad?I think in some ways--Well, I'm gonna go first.Go ahead.I'm on the front lines, soI find out the information.I'm knowing everythingthat's going on first.So you're the one saying wewait till your dad gets home?No, I'm kidding.No, no.You wait till your father gets home.I have a complimentaryanswer to where you're going.And then I fill him in,like just so you know,this is what's going on.So then when he approaches them,he already has background on a situationand it helps himcommunicate with them easier.So he's not 20 questioning them as muchbecause he already has some background.And I found through the years,he's worked from home since COVID,but when he used to bedriving home from work,he would call me and I would fill him inon what went on with them through the day.So when he walked in, hecould kind of ease into ita little bit easier.Cause I don't know ifyou've experienced this,but especially once they turn 12, 13, 14,if you start 20 questioning them,they stop answering all your questions.So it's a dance.I've had two, we just didn't have,they couldn't track us.That was the difference.Yeah, well, no one wasasking us any questions.Yeah, nobody gave it.Well, if you did get asked,you were probably already knew the answer.It was a loaded question.They already knew wherever you wereand they were justwaiting for you to lie to themso that you had a reason to hit you.But anyway, what's your-It was a setup.I was gonna say, Ithink she prevents problems.I probably solve problems.And it's maybe not always with grace,but maybe a bigger hammer or something.Like if there's ever an issue at school,which is very rare to probably count them,she'll work with theadministration to solve it.But I'll be the first to say,we'll come in tomorrowand we'll talk about this type of thing.So I don't know if thatmakes sense to you or not,but you certainly prevent.And I'm like, fuck it,let's see where this goes.Other than when it goes sideways.Then is the heavy.Yeah, then I'm probably the heavy.I was wondering if,because I think about thedynamic of dad versus mom.Are you feeling maybe more like a hybridbecause you're the dadand dads are supposedto show up a certain way.They're supposed to present a certain wayto the family dynamic, to their children,especially being that we're Gen Xersbecause we were taught this dynamicof the dad versus the mom.And dad was the heavy.Dad was usually,although my mom wouldbeat the shit out of youwith a belt and a heartbeat,but dad was usually theone you feared the most.And also dad was theone that we often worry,that was my mom with threat.I mean, I think a lot of uswere threatened with the dad.Like you wait till yourdad's around about that.You wait till your father gets home.I thought that was just me.Apparently that is astandard across Gen Xersthat brothers use.But it was an interesting dynamicas I'm like, do you yourself that waybecause of the way we were--The difference might be,I'm okay if they gethurt and if they're cryingbecause I look at it as a longer journeythat this is part of growing up.It's part, and the world sucks.The world's full ofassholes, world's tough.You need to be able to deal with it, right?And so, whereas she'sthe mom primary caretaker,I don't think she likes to see them hurt.I'm not saying I like to see them hurt,but it's like they're gonna grow from it.And it is, it's the onlyway I could frame it, I guess.I mean, he says that, but his first answeris always if someone hurts them, fuck them.And like, you know, andhe's angry immediately.So I think--That's part of the solution though.Yeah, yeah.I think you're spot on in,and him as a Gen X dadtrying to still hold onto some of thattraditional male role, that vibe.Oh yeah.But also be progressive enoughwhere his children will talk to him.Yeah, he's there for him.That's what I'mwondering if that's maybe wherethat feeling of being a little bit of that,a hybrid, if you will, of like new age dadversus old school dad.And you fall somewhere in the middle,carrying on a little bit of the traditionthat you grew up with, butstill breaking a lot of that,the curses that wewere plagued with, right?Breaking the cycle.So when your parents weremarried, was there a lot of,you said your mom wouldhit you guys with the belt.Was there a lot of physical abuse?My dad was an alcoholic.So yeah, there was a lotof, not just abuse to us,but just domesticviolence in the house in general.And yeah, I mean, if my dad,I can recall my dadbackhanding my brother across the roomand bloodying his nose and stuff like,so I did live in sortof this chaotic hyper,hyper vigilance is likemy, that's my calling card.Like I just, always reading the room.I think that's another thing with Gen Xis that we're always reading the room.We learned at a very,very young age, a lot of us,not all, I'm not in any way implyingthat all of Gen X was abusedor that all of them were hit.Cause I get told thatthat was not my experience.That's great.I'm happy that thatwas not your experience,but for a lot of us it was.And so for a lot of us, welearned really, really youngto read the room, microexpressions, body language,behavior, anticipating andtrying to correct ourselves.I mean, I remember already,I didn't need to be punishedcause I was learning topunish myself at the age of four.You know, I'd stand myself in the corner,myself in the corner.And so, you know,thinking about that of like usat a very young age,already learning hyper vigilanceand like how to read micro expressionsand how to read body language and all thatin an attempt to sort ofpredict and then avoid, right?That's that's an avoidance.And so yeah, for me,that was a pretty standardin my house from my earliest memories.You know, my earliest memorieswere probably around the age of three.So were your copingmechanisms mainly to either be goneand out of the house or just in your roomand away from everything to be hiding.Quiet.Yeah. And you're nervoussystem, fight or flight.Oh yeah.You're a constant fight or flight.Oh yeah. Yeah.You know, that definitely, you know,I've just recently started working,I moved my mom here ayear ago from New Mexicoand we hadn't really beenaround each other in 30 years.And that's been an interesting experience,just getting to know each other again.And it brought up a lotof things in me physicallythat I couldn't explainand it's fight or flightand fawn, all of them.And so it was surprising to me.I thought I had done a lot of workand that I was much further alongand then my mother shows up in my lifeand I'm just, you know,triggered like all over the place.And I'm like, what the fuck is this?So I started EMDR therapyand it's actually helping me tremendouslyto sort of work through some of that.Cause I don't thinktraditional talk therapy,I've always been not,I don't have a problemwith therapy for anybody else,but I always had a barrier to it.Like I wasn't really okay with sitting downand getting reallyintimate and getting into,I don't need to do that with some stranger,but EMDR is different.And so it's helped me tolearn to identify thingsthat trigger me physically.Like your logical brainwill tell you one thing, right?Logical brain is like,we're fine, we're safe.Like what the fuck is your problem?But the other part of your brain,cause the body keeps the score,you know, it's sendingyou the wrong signalsbecause at a very youngage, we were wired essentially.You can think about how you havefundamental foundationalyears where the hard wiring takes placeand is wired for that.And so it's trying to undo those,trying to rip those fuckingwires out and rewire myself.And so that's been an interesting,it's been an interesting year.I think that a lot ofGen Xers can relate to thatof having to care for their parentsor having theirparents live closer to them,all of a sudden, and it triggers traumasthey thought that they had resolvedor that they buried and never dealt withand are now having,cause you almost become that child again,as you said, your body does at least.Yeah.I think it can be very shocking,especially if you've never,if you've buried everything and never dealtwith any of your emotionsas a lot of Gen Xers have,and then you're in midlife,and now you're having to care for someonethat was the cause of a lot of your trauma.And it's almost like being re-traumatized.It is.Well, the body doesn't see it,the body, I had to learn this,the body doesn'tperceive it any differently.The body still perceives it as a threat.Yeah.And so if you don't fix that part,you know, like I said, your logical braincould be telling you one thing,but the body is doingsomething totally different.So it shows up in a lot of ways,shows up in anxiety andstress and heavy breathingand heart palpitations and tensionand just shortness of like,just being short with people.It shows up in so many ways that I never,I mean, I always knew I was wound tight.I would tell it would warn people,I'm wound pretty tight.But I'm learning that that was,that was showing up, thatwound up tight part of mewas showing up undermoments of stress and anxietyas that was a traumaresponse that I didn't recognize.I didn't know because I was the personthat tried to bury the shit as deepas I possibly could under concrete.And unfortunately, it doesn't matter.The truth is for all the listeners,it doesn't matter how deep you bury it,it can resurface someday.And for me, I didn't expect it to show upin the ways that it did with my mom.And so both my parents are still alive.And I knew my dadtriggers the shit out of me.Every time he comes to visit,I'm like, I can tolerateyou for about two days.And then I'm gonna probablystart coming off the railsbecause he justtriggers me all over the place.But I'm aware of that.My mom, I hadn't reallybeen around in 30 years.And so it was surprising to meto discover that I felt like I was havingthese physical responses.So I decided to go and start therapy.A friend recommended EMDRbecause I just was like,I didn't move her here tomake her life miserable.And I realized that I was,because she would say things like,my reaction to hermade her say things like,I'm just a burden, I'mjust a problem for you.And I was like, but you're not.But I realized that my reaction to her,and very short, treating it almost like,this is a task I have to get done.I have to do this, this and this.And then I'm gonna go back to my life.And it was very transactional.And I was like, that's not fair to her.I don't want that to be her experiencefor whatever days shehas left on this earth.And so I decided to do the work.And so I recommend ithighly to people to do this work.What is the EMDR?EMDR, I don't know what the EMDRspecifically stands for.It's like bilateral.So for me, I do it through a computer,but you can go into an office and do it.And it's either through tapping orbilateral stimulationthrough the eyes.So you kind of follow these dots.So you work on certain memories,things that you, maybe trauma or whatever.And you don't really haveto talk through anything.You just watch thesedots and whatever happens,happens and then my therapist will say,what are you feeling?Because you're looking forthe response in the body.Like where do you feel that in the body?And essentially what ishappening is our brains are,they're basically a computer.So when you think about your hard driveand all these files and shit that are on itand the way that it's wired,you're basically reprogramming your brain.You're allowing, you'reworking through memoriesand allowing it to basically like,it's always been sort of wherever it is.For me, it was like in thisnice little tight little chestthat I had locked up,shoved behind another safe door,like I'm not gonna set it.It's dragging those outand figuring out like, okay,where do those belong?How can I process through that feeling?And so, the trigger or the trauma responseand put it where it belongs,where that memory is likeyou're not erasing memories,but they do, what I havenoticed is that over time,they have faded a little bit.Like they're not as prominent.Like I used to bepretty controlled by like,the loop of memoriesthat would just sort of playin my brain that I couldn't control.And it's being able to file thoseand put them in places where they belong.And sure, the memory'sstill there, I can reach for it,but it doesn't disturb mysystem like it did before.You don't need to reprocess it as a--You do, your brain is just reprocessing.You're reprogrammingessentially that wiring,that wiring I was talking about.And so, it's kind oflike taking the wire and go,okay, that wire doesn't really belong here,it belongs over here.And so you just, andyou work, it's wild to me.It's very woo woo tome, it was very woo woo.And in the beginning, Ididn't have any expectations.I was like, this is,initially I was probablya pretty standard gen-exresponse, this fucking stupid.Like what am I doing?But over time, it hasreally allowed me to just show upin ways that I haven't before.And it has allowed me tolike reach for memoriesand not feel that overwhelming response.I can now step in my mother's houseand not feel this instantheaviness that I had felt before.I was just about to ask you that.So if you go into anencounter with your mom,you can deal with it now.Yeah, I'm stillworking-- You've got some school.There's still littlethings we're working on.Oh, I'm sure, yeah, yeah.But yes, it has gotten better.I can now sit down at the tableand have a cup of coffeewith her and just have a chatand not feel all thatstuff that I was feelingthat I couldn't understand.Like I was like, I don't understand,I've been around her in 30 damn years.Why the fuck do I feel like this?Like that was really wild for me.And I couldn't control it.And I knew it was showing up in waysthat were aggressive for me.Like I was snippy withher or short with her,like I said, transactional.And I like, okay, I gotta come in,I gotta do this, thisand this, and then I'm out.And so it's allowed me to work through thatin ways that I don't think,that probably would havetaken me years of talk therapyto get through.And I've done that in six months.So-- It's a huge.Yeah, it almost sounds likeit allowed you to have closurewith each of those experiences.It does. Those experiencesand then disconnect thephysiological reactionthat those memories triggered in you.That's what you're trying to do.It's just, what you'redoing is essentially trying to,you're trying to tell your body like,that's not a threat anymore.Right.And so because the body still perceives,like I said, the body keeps the score.I don't know if you've ever read the book,the body keeps the score, it's very valid.Like the body's gonna say,this is a perceived threat.And not only because ofwhatever happened to youlike as a child with your parents,so it's not just my parents that trigger,but even allowing me to connect the dotswith other things that go on in my life,with my children, with my family,to identify like, ooh, I just,I'm more aware ofwhat's happening in my body,where I'm like, oh, why didthat make me feel that way?Like I'm more aware to be like,oh, I need to think about like what that isand try to connect it,try to figure out wherethat learned behavior came fromor where my body learned that.And it's allowed me tosort of peel back the layersin other aspects of mylife, not just with my mom.Yeah, and it's probably,in a way it's allowed you toground yourself physically,like ground your body more,because I think for a lot of Gen Xers,we've buried our emotions so muchand we have been grinding so hardthat our mind and our bodykind of became disconnected a little bit,because you're just kindof going through the motionsof life sometimeswithout being fully groundedphysically head to toes,like toes deep into the ground.And so by what you're doing,by disconnecting thosetraumas physiologicallyfrom your body andallowing your body to heal,you're fully present.Yeah, that was something,I love that you said that,because I can tell you prior to,I spent 51 years of mylife, 50 years of my lifenot being present.I could be here and we couldbe having this conversation,but my brain could bedoing all kinds of wild shit.And like I said, that kind of loopthat just sort of always made in my brain,like I would wake up in the morningand I would for a moment have like peaceand then it would just kind of flood inand that's sort of, andthat's the stuff that you're like,nobody knows, you just put that over,I know it's here, but Ican still get through that,I just grind, we justgo, we just suck it upbecause that's what we were told to do,you're fine, suck it up, rubsome dirt on it, keep going.And that's how I went through life.And so yes, it hasallowed me to be more present.And I talk about thisbecause it's so important of like,life is happening in them now.So many people spend somuch of their lives in the pastor in the future thatthey're missing all of what lifehas to offer, all the goodthat's happening right herein the moment.And I had never really truly been livinguntil I figured out how to be present.And I was working on mindsetand working on being present before EMDR,like I had been, 50 wasa big like year for mewhere I was like, Igotta shed this baggage,this shit is heavy.And so I was alreadyworking on sort of trying to learnto ground myself and be presentso I could control my thoughts.But this EMDR process has made,I don't even have to work as hard at it.It has allowed me to be morein the moment and more aware,like I said, more in tune with my own bodyand how my body's showing up,even when my brain isshowing up in a different way.And so that has been just amazing to have,for the first time in my life to be like,oh, my brain and my body are in sync.Yeah. Wow, wow.Yeah, and as a result,you can truly enjoymoments that are enjoyablebecause I know I found for myselfbefore I connectedfully with my body again,even in enjoyable, relaxing moments,I still wasn't 100% there.My body was still tense.I was still in fight or flight,even though I'm going through the motions.Yeah, this is great,but I'm still on alert.But when you go through that and you groundand you become fully present,then you can enjoy the good times trulyand your body can relax and enjoy it too.You remember more of those moments.Like memory has alwaysbeen a struggle for mefrom the time I was a child.I think a lot of that just hasto do with trauma in general.I know it does,because I've talkedabout that with my therapist,but looking back at momentsthat should have beenreally significant in my lifeand big joyful momentsand having so littlerecollection of those moments,that's sad for me.And so now it's like,oh, I can fully embraceand enjoy these moments in the present.And my memory is a much, much more,it's a much broader memory now.I'm able to be like, oh,there's more detail to it.There's more to thememory than what I had before,rather than just these little snippets,almost like a little movie trailer.Now I'm able to really take in moreof what is happening in the moment.And I look back and I'm like, that's sad.That the first 50 years of my life,I didn't really have that.I didn't reallyexperience life in that way.Yeah, but I think that Gen Xers,especially disassociationwas like our number one tool.It is.And it was our survival mechanism.It was everything.So I think for a lot of us,just not disassociating anymore,is like can be shocking to the system.Because that's a-It's also recognizingwhen you're disassociating.That's something I never could do before.And now I'm able to go, why are you there?Why are you here?I never could do that before.I couldn't have that kind of controlover where my brain was goingor what my brain was thinking aboutor what my body was doing.Now I'm able to be moreaware and more in tune with that.And I talk about this a little bit.You guys are kind of the first peopleI've talked about the EMDR thing with.But I wanna talk to share that with peoplebecause there is hope.I think for a lot oftimes, most of my life,a lot of times I feltlike there was no hope.I was just meant to livethat way my entire life.And that's a horrible place space to be in.When you just feel overwhelmed all the timeby these emotions, youdon't know how to expressand you don't know how to control them.And you also don'tknow what to do with them.Nobody wants to hear,we also were never told,we also were toldnobody ever wanted to hearhow we felt either.So also believe that nobody wants to hearabout your feelings.And so finally arrivingat a place where I'm like,there is hope.You can actually feel joyand happiness and peace.And you can feel like youare standing in your own powerwhere I never did before.A certain event that,because I feel likeI've gone through a similarenlightenment orepiphany, whatever it might be.Awakening.Awakening, it was there,and it feels like it'salmost onset with agebecause I can't traceit back to anything else.Was there anything like that for you?Was it, do you think it's age?Was there an event, some big--There wasn't an event, agedefinitely played a factor.So I'm always sort of looking back at me,even my 30s, my 40s, Iwas too young and stupid.I was just surviving in my 20s.I was a young mom, I had a kid at 17,like 20s is a blur.But my 30s and my 30sand 40s, I always wanted.Like I had this hope and wishfor wanting to feel the way I feel now,but never knowing how to do it.Like it just felt like an impossible thing.You'd hear people talk about it,but it just sounded like that,like some fantasy, somemyth, like that's not real.And so turning 50 for me,I think was the big moment.I really struggled withthe idea of turning 50.Like it was this loominghuge number that I was like,I can't believe I'm turning 50,partly because I think alot of Gen Xers like myselfdidn't think I'd live that long.I didn't think we planned for that.We lived hard, ranhard, the whole work hard,play hard mentality.And we just were like,only the good die young.That's what we were told.And so it was like, Ididn't really plan to get there.So when 50 was coming,I was like, holy shit,I'm turning 50.I think you become, I did for me,became suddenly very aware of my mortality,which I don't know whythat 50 number made mevery aware of my mortality.And this idea of like time was running outand not, I think for me specifically,I can't speak forothers, but for me personally,for living 50 yearsand never really feelinglike I had ever reallylived, that was scary.I'm like, fuck, time is running outand I haven't even lived.So that was a big numberand a big moment for me.And something happened when Iturned 50 that just was like,it was like an awakening.It was like this unraveling of like,it was almost like there had been theselittle frayed threadsfor a long time that Iwas always afraid to pull atfor fear that I would just fall apart.And then one day I juststarted picking away at themand I realized that as I pulled them out,that I wasn't falling apart,I was actually falling into place.And so I just startedletting that shit unraveland wanting to belike, for me, it was like,look, I plan to live tobe like over a hundred.I've been planning thatfor a long fucking time,even though I didn'tplan to live this long.In my brain, I was alwayslike, I'm gonna live to be,my great-grandmother lived to be 104.And so I was always like,I'm gonna live as long as she did.And so in my mind, after Iaccepted like, okay, you're 50,that's a big number, time is running out.Yeah, okay, in my brain,I'm convinced I'm gonnalive another 50 years plus,but this first 50 years went by so fast,that I'm like, time is running out.And if that first 50 yearswent by as fast as it did,this next 50 is going to be like this,because time justspeeds up as we get older.And so I just wanted sobadly to just truly knowwhat it felt like to really liveand feel what happiness felt like and joy.Not happiness, likewhere your babies are bornand you're like, oh myGod, I'm so happy, I love you.That's like a, not that kind of happiness,but like genuinely trueeveryday peace and happiness and joyand just finding good in my days,not always looking into the dark,which is where I spent most of my life,was sort of in the past.You were unpacking your traumaand you were honoringyourself for the first,you were honoring thatlittle girl and that teenagerand that young womanthat never was given that,her moment, her time,and you finally createdspace to honor yourself.And you looked at the nexthalf of your life and said,it's her time now.And made a decision to livean authentic life for you.But in order to dothat, you have to unravel,you have to unpack so thatthat healthy version of yourself,the version you weresupposed to be and would have beenif you hadn't grown upin trauma can now exist.Yeah, I talk about thattoo, like, who would you beif you could bewhoever you were meant to bebefore the world got its hands on you?That's the version of me that I am today,is like, I'm stillworking on that version of me.Like, who I'm supposed to bebefore the world got its hands on me.And so I try to share that with othersbecause I want that sobadly for other people.I know what it's like to livein that darkness for so longthat I'm like, that's whatreally got me making videosto begin with, was wanting to just somehoweither inspiresomebody or share some nuggetthat I had learned.I don't even call it wisdom.It's just like, this is what I think.I don't, it worked for me.I don't know if it's gonna work for you,but I'm willing to shareit because you know what?Wisdom serves nobody but yourselfunless you share it with other people.I was like, I never hadanybody sharing any kind of insightlike that with me.I wish that I had hadthat, but you know, for me,I'm like, I love being ableto connect and touch peoplein my age demographic,but I really wanna touch the young people.I wanna give them those nuggets to be like,listen, figure it out sooner.Cause if I could just get back 10 years,that time that I wasted in that dark place,in that miserable place,in that depressed place,in that place that wasconstantly showing upbecause of my trauma, likethat person, that version of me,if I could give that to somebody elseand they could get back some of that time,like that's all, that's why I do it.Even if it's just one person,to just have them, and maybe I never know.I'm like, that old saying, what is it?The student appearswhen the lesson is neededor something like that.I don't know what the teacher, teacher,but whatever the fucking saying is,I'm hoping to be the teacher maybe,that goes up when they need it.Well, and I think also a lot of Gen Xershave worked hard to try tobreak the cycle as parents.And so hopefully just bybeing different parentsto our children, we're giving them that,to we're giving them their own voice.We're giving them space to expressthemselves, anything.Even if it's the smallest thing,we're honoring whatever it is.Even if it's a Tuesday andthey feel like the world'sfalling apart, we knowit's gonna be fine tomorrow.They don't.We're stopping and we're saying,okay, let's talk aboutthis instead of being like,it's no big deal, go away.So I think by us doing that,we're already givingthem so many of those tools.And then I think Gen Xersand especially Gen X women,the more we talk about all this,if you combine the two,hopefully they're gonnabe 10 steps ahead of usby the time they hit 30s and 40sand not have to gothrough some of the suffering.I can tell you when I get to menopause,my kids are gonna know.Oh yes.You asked if there was a big moment.It's 50 yes.Yes.Menopause.Listen, the shit startsfalling off really fastwhen you hit menopause.You're just like, my give a damn meteris completely busted, okay?And so that was part of it too,is I think you just hit this phase of lifeand just suddenly things just hit differentwhen you're in menopause.Oh, 100%.I know for myself, I wasin perimenopause in my 40sand I had no idea.No one talked about it.No one talked about it.No one was talking about it.I didn't know either.I look back, I quit mycorporate job when I was 40.It'll be 10 years this year.So I was 43.And I look back at that timeand I had been a 26year career investigator.I loved my job until I didn't.And then I was like, Igotta get the fuck out of here.So I quit with no plan.I didn't know what I was gonna do.I didn't have a job.I'd never done that.I had always worked my entire life,made sure I had anotherjob before I quit that job.And so it was the first time in my lifewhere I was like, no, I don't care.I have to get out of here.I'm gonna, I literallyam going to go crazy.And I look back and go,I was probably in perimenopause then.I went to the doctor.I remember before I quit my job,knowing I felt off,something felt crazy in me,crazier than normal.And they wanted to putme on antidepressants.And they made me feel really shitty.And I was like, no, Idon't like this feeling.I don't want to be medicated like that.So I didn't do that.So I just went through my40s not knowing like youbecause nobody was talking about it.Perimenopause was not even a word.I thought menopause wasjust like the only thing.Like you just, you stop having a periodand then you're just in menopause, right?But then to find out there's perimenopauseand that that can last for 10 plus years.And there's over a hundreddifferent symptoms associated.I was like, why are wenot talking about this?Why is nobody talking?So, and if people don't know,suicide rates are highest forwomen in our age demographicand drug abuse and alcohol abuse.And you're in your fifties age bracketor starting in the 40s?40s to fifties, yeah.That age range, highest suicide rates,highest divorce rates arehigh, drug and alcohol abuse,because so many women aregoing through all these changesand not knowing what is going on.And you, like me, I felt crazy.I felt insane.It's a silent thing.And it can hit as early as 35.That's why I tell GenX women, talk about it,talk about it,because a lot of these millennial womencould be going throughthese things at 35, 30 times.They're all starting to go through it.Some of them are, they're talking about it.There's a wholemovement, I think it's hilarious,but I love it, on TikTok,where I keep seeing thesevideos pop up of these womenin their 30s and early 40stalking about perimenopause.And I'm like, yes, Ithank God for social mediain this regard of likebeing able to put this kindof awareness out there.And it's funny, but thenthere's some of those videosthat are not funny.They're literally women begging other womento what is wrong with me?Like, what can I do?Because there just needs tobe more education around it.And more doctors needmore education for sure,but we need to be talking about it.So I love to see people likeDrew Barrymore and Halle Berryand Oprah and all theseother people with huge platformsget behind talking about menopause,because it's a really big mental healthand physical health problem for womenthat is not being,does not get the attention it needs.So menopause for me wasreally one of another big factor.And I think it is for a lot of women.I think it-I think that it can be a positive thingin that it can give usthat personal freedomto just go for thingsmaybe before we win it,but it gives us that, Idon't give a shit anymore.I'm doing what I want,fuck everyone attitude.So I think there's a positive to it.There's a positive to it,but I don't think we need tofeel like we're going crazyor utter shit through the process.Yeah, no, that's thepart they need to do better.It's like women, so many women talk aboutgoing to their doctors in perimenopauseand being gas-lipped by the doctors,telling them that this is just normal.This is just normal phase of lifeor there's nothing wrongwith you, your levels are fine.They want to, again, likeme, put them on antidepressantsand I look back, like Isaid, when I quit my job,had I known more aboutwhat was happening to my body,maybe I wouldn't have made,maybe I wouldn't have quit my job.Not that it was a bad thing.I've been in business formyself now for almost 10 yearsand life is great, buteverything happens for a reason.But I do look back at thatand there's times Imiss being an investigator.I love doing what I diduntil, like I said, I didn't.And so, my hope is forwomen, especially younger,that we'll get towhere we have more doctorsthat are advocating forwomen, that are more educated,that are not gas-lighting these womeninto believing thatthere's nothing wrong with them,that it's all in their heads.And that's a law that a lotof doctors are telling womenis it's just in your head.And they're bandating thesymptoms, antidepressants,go exercise more, change your diet.Eat less, you're overweightbecause you're eating too much.Oh, a lot of these women, they're like,I literally work out every single day.I barely am eating anythingand I'm still gaining weight.And so, what they're doingis they're lacking nutrition.They're lacking whattheir bodies actually need,which is doing other harm to thembecause they're trying not to gain weightbecause society tells you that you'resupposed to be skinnyor there's all these self-esteem issuesand all these other things that creep up.Your skin starts tochange, your hair changes,like all these things start to changeand you suddenly become,you feel less relevant,you see it feel less appealing, all this.And then, it's just a snowball.It's a big snowball.Yeah, and then a lot ofwomen during this timeare still caring for young children.Yes. So there's knees there.And because it's not talked about,I mean, if you think the womendon't know what's going on with them,their partners have no clue.That's what I was gonna say.We have no fucking idea what's going on.At least in middle-Did you ever have anyidea what was going on?I'll plead the fish.No, but at least in middle school,boys do get an idea ofwhat girls go throughthrough puberty, so theyunderstand physiologically.They get their period, da, da, da.But there's no conversation for menabout perimenopause and menopause.And so you see marriages falling apart.Well, men go throughmenopause too, that's the thing.They don't call it menopause.But men also- It's like eight menopause.Men also go through a cycle of menopausewhere they're also affected,their energy and their libidoand your moods are affected.And so you have kind of this combinationwhich is basicallybuilding the perfect bombif you don't work on it, right?And so that's where,yeah, the divorce rates,one or the other or both.They just are like,"Okay, I'm done."Where those marriages might've been,they might've been greatmarriages until one day,menopause catches up and they're like,"I'm over your shit.I'm sick of everything, shit."Yeah.What's that book,"What toExpect When You're Expecting?"Yeah, they need to make one."What to Expect When You're..."Yeah, when you hit what?I don't even know.It's not middle age.Well, technically.Technically. Middle age.Because technically, if yougo based on life expectancy,they say 35 is like middle age.I'm like, "Yeah, fuck you.That's really good."Yeah, I don't buy that.I want you.But you could say,"What toExpect When You're Midlife,"because that's ages 35and up to probably 60.That's kind of midlife, 55, 60.Because there's some women that get there,they don't go throughmenopause until later.They may be 52, 54, whatever.And so, yeah, I say there's no handbook.We should be issued astandard issue handbookwhen we get to this point in life.It kind of lists all this shit out.But yeah, there's not, and there should be.I think there should be more OBGYNs toothat specialize inmidlife and hormones for women,because there's plenty totake care of the baby stuff,but there's so few there for women our age.And to your point, we gethanded all this informationabout get your mammogram, da-da-da-da-da.There should be a pamphlet ora piece of paper even saying,these are the signs of perimenopause.These are things that look out--How are you feeling these thingsif so talk to your doctor?I am very fortunate to have an amazing,I highly recommend, I saythis to women all the time,if you have a doctorthat's gaslighting you,if you have a doctorthat's not listening to youand you feel all these things,find a doctor that will listen and thatwill advocate for you.I have a doctor who ismy OBGYN, who is my age.She's actually acouple years older than me,so she's in the thick of it herself.And she is probably oneof the few doctors I foundthat listens to everything.And she knows, becauseshe's going through it.So I highly recommend it.You got some doctor gaslighting you,because the women doctors do it too.100%.And sometimes they're worse.This is just the way it is.It's not the way it is.We don't have to suffer.And there's so many otherside effects of menopausethat needs to be addressed.We start losing musclemass and bone densityand there's all these other things.And cognitive function,there's lots of variousthings that are showing up.But I highly recommend,go find yourself a doctorthat's in your age.And I guarantee you theywill see things differently.Not a male, no offense, no male doctor.But you need a female doctor.I don't know how you could goto a male doctor for this.I agree with you.You have to give this tosomeone your age or olderwho's been through it or is in it.Well, you gotta be carefuleven with some of the older onesbecause when I make menopause videos,because I do, I joke around about it a lot.Because all I can do is poke fun at itbecause it's so stupid.But a lot of some of, Ifeel like the 60 and up,so the boomers, they're basically like,it just is what it is.They are still gaslighting it, suck it up.It never gets any better, just get over it.They're still living. No sitting in the sunand eat more things. They're still livingthat way. Yeah.They are.But I feel, especially with menopause,they hardcore judge us.And once in a while, in general,when people are projecting stuff,I'm like, that's not about me.That's about their own situation.But once in a while, Imay comment back and say,what's different is Gen Xwomen are talking about it.So the younger generations are educatedand don't have to suffer.You guys suffered, we suffered.We're trying to change the narrativeand be part of a cultural shift.You're way better than I am at that.Cause you know what?So my mom, I asked my mom one day,I was like, why did you not warn me?Why did you not tell me?Cause they don't talk about it.Her response was, well, nobody told me.This is how they see shit.Like nobody told me.So basically you're like, fuck you,you're on your own, figure it out.That's how I feel.You are way better at likegoing through the explainer.Me, I'm like, you know what?This is where my, I don'tgive a fuck attitude shows up.And I don't give a fuck.Okay.We are going to, we are not,we are going to talk about it,whether you want us totalk about it or not.And I'm, you know what?I could say I'm doing itfor all the younger peopleand maybe, yeah, the rude I am,but I'm doing this for me.I'm talking about it because you know what?This shit sucks and everybody needs to knowhow shitty this is.And it's funny, right?I talk about it in a funny way,but it is to get people to go,wait, that's what's so manywomen in the comments are like,wait a minute, this iswhat's going to happen to me.I want them to pay attention.I want them to be like, holy shit.This is, and so when they get there,they might be quicker to identify like,this is what's going on with my body.This is what's happening to me.I'm not crazy because theydo make so many women feellike they're crazy.And that's not fair.You know, so.We're undermined in general with our healthand then let alone if we come inwith a mental health issue.So I mean, no, you're a tool in this.You know, you'rebringing it to the forefrontand you're kind ofsaying, look, I'm future you.Listen to me before you get here.I'm giving you the tools.Let me tell you what'sgoing to happen to you.(laughing)And also bringing awareness.So men can finally hearthis because I'm telling you,there's so many men.It's the first time Ithink they've heard anythingabout perimenophiles and menophiles.We just assume you're crazy.I will give it to some ofthe guys in my comments,not all, but there are alot of guys who are like,oh my God, they see, andI make a video like that.They're able to go, this is my wife.And now you just, I've given them adifferent perspective.And they've, a lot of themwill be okay saying that.Like I am, you know, I'm here for her.I'm, you know, I'mgoing to be there to honorwhat she's going through.And they'reunderstanding, but some guys are not.Some are just like, she's a raging bitchand I can't stand her.And it's like, she can't control that.Like she's, her hormones are all fucked up.And when you start to lack estrogen,we start to lack empathy.So that's where my gofuck yourself kicks in.You want to be anasshole, I can be one in return.Absolutely, absolutely.I think it's a fullshift in a relationship.And it gets the pointwhere the men in their livesare either going to goalong for the ride or you're outbecause-And I think a lot of womendo get there where they just,well, not just the women.I think some guys too are, no,I'm not in any way minimizing for the men.It's not easy to go through that and watchand like have this person who you've lovedfor however long and theperson that you fell in lovewould suddenly not bethat person anymore, right?Because we're not the same people.Like we are definitelygoing through an evolution,a metamorphosis, if you will,into a different version of ourselves.But we can't control it.It's not something we'redoing that's changing it.And I think some guys can't take that.Or they're like, this isnot what I signed up for.And so, in some cases the guy checks out,but in a lot of cases itis the women who are like,I'm done because they don't have-Which is why we all needto be talking about it.Men too.I love to see mentalking about their experiencewith their wife going through itand the things they did to help her.And as a result, theyhave a better relationship.They're closer, it'sstrength than their relationship.So I'm hoping more of that comes outthe more we talk about it.But to go back, when your parents divorced,did you go with your mom?Like how was the custody agreement?Oh, that's a whole,that's a can of worms, man.So I did go with my mom and well,we were kind of alwayson the run a little bit.And so when we finally got away,they didn't divorce right away.I was with my mom.And then, I lived with mymom for maybe six months or so.So my dad always, he's a frugal fuckand always money was alwaysa problem for him, still is.And he didn't want to paychild support for a childhe didn't have.And so my mom didn't have a job.She was just starting over.She had just met herfuture husband at the timeand decided that he wasgonna fight her for custody.So she didn't fight and Ihad to go live with my dad.So I lived with him forthree and a half years.And so I was old enough to choose.I was told at that time, when you're 12,you can decide who you wanna live with.And so when I was 12, Iwent back to live with my mom,but it was a littletoo late by then for me.So I was-When you were nine or eight or nine?I lived with, yeah, I wasprobably closer to nine,eight and a half or so when I had to go.I was just, I was in the third grade.I just remember that.I was in the thirdgrade numbers or that age.That's eight or nine.So you had been withyour brother your whole lifeand now you're living in separate houses?No, no, my brother was gone too.So that's what I said,it's a whole can of worms.My brother, my dad was a lot meaner to himbecause he wasn't his son.He was mean to everybody, but I mean,he even kicked the damn dog,but he was pretty mean to my brother.And we were sent awayto my grandparents a lot.And my grandparents, my mom's parents,they were pretty religiousand they lived out in the country of Ohioand we were there a lot.And my brother eventually,he wasn't doing well in fourth gradeand he came home withsome F's on his report cardand they just decided to send himto my grandparents permanently.So my grandparentspretty much raised my brother.And so I was already separated from him.So it was just me and my mom and my dad.And so, yeah, then my momand I were kind of on the runon and off and yeah, thenI had to go live with himfor three and a half years.So fourth, fifth, sixthgrade, I lived with my dad.Did you have to change schools?Oh yeah, but we werealways kind of moving around.When you're a family withdomestic violence issues,you tend to not stay put very long.You move around a lot becausethe neighbors pay attention,the cops are at your house, shit like that.So we never set still very long anyway.I think I went to like fourdifferent elementary schools.And middle school, Ialways say is I hate it.I think it's the worsttime of all the school.I agree.It's the worst to be in it.And it's the worst to beparents of kids in middle school.Like I have four.Oh yeah, I have two.I've one in middle school, one justfinished middle school.It's the worst.I saw PTSD, especially girls.Oh, terrible.I saw PTSD from our daughterbecause there's mean girls, right?And they're mean to your girls.And so it's a whole thing.And then you want tobe mean to them, Jennie.You're like, "We used to solvethis kind of shit after schoolout in the park or behind the school.We threw hands.And if you talk shit, yougot punched in the mouth."We don't do that anymore.I occasionally think weshould go back to that.But anyway.Oh no, when there would bemean girls towards my daughter,like I did want to do that.I would go, and my daughter would be,I'd be so, I would have that Jenniex react.I've told her even if they're marriedand I see them in thegrocery store when I'm 80,I'll still curse them as I walk.Well, still don't wantto punch them in the face.It's never over.Yeah, it's never over.It's a funny sidebar.Our daughter will give her shit for that.Our daughter's like,"I'm good.I'm past that."She's like, "I'm not."I'm not.Yeah, I'm not good.We would go round andround pulling each other's hairif this was me back in mid school.Yes, absolutely.But so you went through all thisand then now you're in middle school.So that just added evenmore fun to middle school.Did you, were there any reprieves for you?Did you play sports?Did you do art?Did you have clubs?Anything that gave you anoutlet to give you a break?No, no.So I went to live withmy mom seventh grade year.I went from living in with my dadin this sort of middleclass, white picket fence,although we didn't havethat, we lived in an apartment,but little middle class, white picket fencekind of suburb outside of the cityto then moving to theinner city with my mom.And so I went to, we called it junior high,but I went to juniorhigh, seventh, eighth grade.No, I did not play sports.I was in the band because you had to be.You had to pick band or choir or some shit.I had already donechoir in elementary school,so I had no desire to do that.And no, I didn't play sports.I wasn't in any clubs.I didn't have any, my outlet was drinkingand doing recreational shit that I wasn'tsupposed to be doing.So you started that inmiddle school or junior high?Yeah, yeah.I mean, there was nothing else to do.And I was at, now let mepaint the picture a little bit.I was in the innercity, it was the eighties.In inner city Toledo, which is basically30 minutes south ofDetroit, it's the eighties, drug,more on drugs is pretty big at that time.Violent crime is very high.We'd be walking to school or,I mean, I rode publictransportation to school,so we walked a lot because wehad to take the bus downtownand catch a transfer to get out to school.And very different thanriding a yellow bus to school.Anyway, catching the transfer downtown,there's homeless people and bag ladiesand drug deals happening onthe corner and shit like that.So I was exposed to a lotof shit in seventh gradeand also just coming from the suburbswhere there really was none of that.And so it was a very big shift in my,a huge pivot in my life of like,if you wanna survive in that environment,you have to show up a certain way.And that's what I had to learn to do.And so my don't fuck with me wall,it's pretty permanent now.I put off a certain, butthat I had to learn thatbecause I was getting jumped.I would get jumped by people, for noreason, just breathing.I just didn't look like I didn't belong.And so I was getting pickedon and bullied and jumped.And so you learned to fight back.And so my club was the,hanging out with the peoplewho would whip your ass club.It was one of those, that's what I wasdoing just to survive.It wasn't gonna be, Ilooking back, I'm like,I didn't wanna be that,but that's what I had to bein order to survive theenvironment that I was in.And so it was very different.And it was middleschool, junior high was roughas was high school.Did you ever go to bars?Cause I know in theeighties, a lot of us were ableto get into bars even.We had our own clubs.I was clubbing in eighthgrade and even into high schoolbecause they would havelike these junior nightclubsand we would go to the club.We were dancing and a lot ofdrugs were being passed aroundand shit like that in there.But that's why looking at my girls now,I was that age at that time.And I'm like, holy shit,the stuff that I was doingat that age, I will never tell them.I will never tell thembecause I don't wanna plantany seeds, but no, I wasjust, it was a, you know,it was not yourtraditional, I didn't go, I didn't eat.I never went to college.I got pregnant when Iwas 16, I had my kid at 17.I didn't even finish high school.I didn't get my GED till later.I was very much abyproduct of where I was livingand growing up and theenvironment around me.And I somehow managed to get out of that.That's a tough, tough,tough, tough town, right?I mean, that's because that was probablywhen the auto industry left too.It was.So it was a depressed area.It was a weird decline at that time.Yeah, yeah.Falling apart, it's a big industrial cityfor people who don't know.In the steel belt andvery, you know, white,or not white color, bluecollar, you know, type city.And at the time, you know, Toledo was not,it was not, it's still not thriving,but that was sort of thebeginning of the decline.Like it's really not a thriving city now.They've got it, right?Yeah, they did.The only thing keepingthat there is Jeep's factorythat they built.That's the only thing reallyholding that city together.But, you know, at the time, you know,this would have been, like I said,84, 85, you know, up through.And I didn't leave Toledo until my jobtook me to Cincinnati in 08.So I stayed there till like 08.Always wanting out.I knew I wanted out, but it was just,I had to find, you know, a way to get out.I think if my career, if Ihadn't got a job transfer,I don't know if I might still be there.I hated it there, butyeah, it's a rough city.And it was rougher.I can't say rougher.I just went home a couple, like two years,a year and a half ago to visit my sisterand my brother and my dad.And I was shocked at how,what the city looks like now.It was, it's almost a shell of what it was.And it was already ashitty place before that.So it's worse, not vice-shred.Yeah, it's worse.It's worse.Crime has definitely gotten worse.It's kind of, I don'tknow if you know anythingabout Youngstown.It happened to Youngstown years before thatwhere everything kind of pulled outand it's just a shell of a city,a lot of crime and low income.And that's sort ofwhat's happened to Toledo,just tiny littlepockets that are still decent.But we lived in Michigan for a winterjust north of Detroit.And we were there whenDetroit probably wasn't too bad,but to your point, it declined.And yeah, it's crazy there.Yeah, I worked in our city of Detroitas an investigator for five yearsduring probably some of its worst years.When the mayor and the governor,there was a lot of controversy.One of them went to prison.It was four of the five years I was there.Detroit was the mostdangerous city in the country.It was rough.And going back toToledo, a couple of years ago,I was like, this reminds me of Detroit,which was wonderful to me.So in high school,was it a boyfriend that you had your,did your son, right?Yeah, my son.Was it a boyfriend?Yeah, he was a high school sweetheart.Yeah.Oh, okay.Tony and I.Are you still in touch like co-parent?Oh, yeah, we still in touch.Yeah, yeah.Oh yeah, we kind of grew up and grew apart.I think like some highschool sweethearts do.He's a cop.He's been, I mean, we both,while the way thatworked, I wanted to be a cop.I let him be a copbecause we didn't think it was wisefor our child to have two parentswho are both police officers.And so I went into the private sectorand got an investigatorjob and that was my career.And so, yeah, we still keep in touch.And we left.We always, when we split,the most important thing was that wecreated an environmentfor our son where hehad still had two parentsand that we were never,we never pinned eachother against one another.He could go to his dad's if he wanted.He could come home to me.He was, you know, he hadthat freedom to do that.And so, yeah, Tony and Iwill always be friends.We said, we'll grow old one day,rocking on a porch androcking chair together.Did you guys get married?We never legally got married, no.No, we didn't.Were you together?We were together 11 years.Okay.So you got pregnant, youhad your son, you left school.Were you home with yourson for a while before?Like, did you start working?Oh, I've been working myentire life since I was 14.So I was already working.My job as I climbed my career excelled.I was, you know, I was gone.I was an investigator.I would be gone sometimes, you know.At that time when he was really young,I was home every day,because I had a job that was isolatedto just the one city that I was in.But then as my career progressed,I started beingresponsible for multiple territories.And so I would be gone sometimesfor a couple of days at a time or whatever.But he was always, he would be with his dador his grandmother and he never,you know, I can't say never looking back,I've said to him at times, like, you know,I hope he never feltlike I wasn't there enough,but I know I wasn't.You know, I know I could have,I missed out on some parts of his lifethat I wish I had been present for,but the job I was, had,you know, to pay the billsand that was what did it.How old were you whenyou became an investigator?I was 19.Oh, wow.Well, I mean, that'swhere my career startedand then it progressed.Eventually when I left my career,I was doing organized crime investigations.And so it just sort of progressed.Early on, I was getting into the ORC stuff,the organized crime stuff.And then it just, itbecame a bigger and biggerand bigger issue as my career grew.That's what I specialized in.And so, but I did a lot ofinternal investigations too.Were you considered a cop?No, no, no, no, no, no, no.Tell me.What kind of investigator were you?Like a private eye or?No, no, no, no, not private.I just worked in the private sector.So I worked for other,for different companiesand did internal investigationsor large scale fencing type cases,like fencing operations.So large scale theftcases is what I worked.Yeah.So you would get hiredby companies basicallyto do investigative work.I worked for different companies.Yeah, I worked in either their assetprotection departmentor in their safety department.Sometimes we did safety investigations.It depends on what company it was,but I worked forvarious, let's see how many,probably five or six different companiesduring that course of my 26 year career.When I came here, it wasHome Depot that brought me.I worked for Home Depot.Their organized crime division,they called it CIT,Central Investigations Team,where I covered the whole countryand did large scalefencing operations for them.Not like just lossprevention, but organized.Yeah, this was a specialized program,specialized teams strategically placedthroughout the country that specializedonly in organized crime.So did you enjoy it?I loved it.I loved being an investor.I love the hunt.So I love, not only that,I not only love the hunt,but the more I've become aware,like as I've done thiswhole discovery process.I think it wasn't just the hunt.I do like the hunt.I like piecing things together.I like discovering,uncovering things that lead me,give me clues to other things.I really enjoyed that part.My brain lights up when I do that.But I've also realized that there's a part,I think a strong part of methat enjoyed bringing justice.I always wanted to be a cop.And letting Tony pursue thatcareer, I don't regret that.But I always knew that Ihad this desire to write,like right wrongs or insome way bring about justice.And so I felt veryrewarded when a case would cometo closure and we'd go totrial and I'd put people in prison.I did enjoy that very much.And did you, you saidyou left Toledo in 07?Yeah, I think I movedto Cincinnati in like 08.Yeah.And still as an investigator.You were still-Yes.And then from Cincinnati,did you go to where you are now or did you-To Atlanta.Okay.And then during that time,because I know you said you were 43when you stopped being an investigator.I quit my job at 43.Yeah. So it'll be 10 years this year.Okay. So during that time,did you have any other personal,you must've had otherpersonal relationships.You have two daughters.I am celebrating 20years this year with my wife.Okay.How did you guys meet?How did you meet your wife?I was in Detroit.She worked, we both workedin, she grew up in Detroit,but we both worked inDetroit and we met there.She moved into my housepretty quickly in Toledoand then I got transferred to Cincinnati.So she came to Cincinnati with meand she's seven years younger than me.She wanted kids.So we had our first in Cincinnati.And then we moved,Lily must've beenabout a year and a half oldwhen we moved to Atlanta.My job brought me here.So she moved, she'smoved many times for me.And yeah, we've been herefor maybe 13 years this year.Now, does she work as well?Well, we both own businesses together.Okay, so the businessesyou have, that's what--Yeah, she used to be,she was a teacher before.She was a teacher and then she taught,well, the job she quit finallywhen we started our own businessesand things were going well.She was actually a professor.She taught online college courses.So she, that's whereshe lived with her worldas education and mediaand technology instructoris what she was doing before she quit.And now we, that's all we do.We just run our businesses together.That helps in your contentcreation, I would assume.And then online--Which are the fact that you workand live with the same person.No, not just that, butthe fact that she taught,what was it, media and--Media and technology,it actually doesn't help.It was very different.Hers was more like how to fix the printerin an administrativeoffice and shit like that.But, or how to, whatever,tech has changed so muchsince she was in school.It's very different now.But I couldn't help but make fun of like,which part, the part where you workand live with the same person all the time,24 hours a day and youparent with those people as well?Like that, yeah, sure,there's a lot of content in there.Oh yeah, so when you guyswere having your daughters,though, was she alsoworking as a teacher thenand you were working as an investigator?Yeah, she was a teacher when we had Lily.And then when Reese was born,I think at that time she wasn't working.She was just kind of astay-at-home mom with Lily.Because I was gone a lot, soshe was a stay-at-home mom.And then when Reese was born,I think Reese must havebeen maybe, I don't know,one or two years oldwhen she started teachingonline college courses,but it was all remote,so it worked, so she would teach from home,remote college instruction.And so she was able to work from home.And then eventually I was like,I just want you to quit that job.I don't want you to do that.I don't want you to just do this.And so eventually she was able to quitand we just have run ourown businesses together.She's the one that encouragedme to quit my job when I quit.She was definitely theone stoking that fire,like just quit, just quit.And I was like, it took me a long timeto work up the nerve to do it,because it was scary to me.I'd never been without a job.And that's, I think,another classic sign of Gen X too,is we've been workingsince we were very young.And yeah, I started working when I was 14,lied about my age, you know?You didn't need a work permit.Your work, if you did, itwas like a piece of paperwork permit, you know, youcould fake any signature on,nobody gave a shit.And I never had been without a job.And so she knew I wasmiserable and very unhappyand also not knowingthat I was in perimenopauseat the time.She was like, just quit.She would text me every day.Did you quit yet?Did you quit yet?And it took me a few months.I had written up my resignation letterand I sat on it for areally long time until one day.I was just like, today's the day.And I quit.The courage that had to have taken,because that was such a leap of faithfor so many reasons for you, you know,from where you camefrom, from your childhood.Everything I had, I built on my own.Nobody gave me anything.And so it was a veryscary thing for me to quitwith no safety net.Yeah.Did you have any plan at all?No, no, my plan was, I'm gonna quit.I have one year.I told myself I had enough money saved up.I could live for a year.And if I couldn't figureout what I was gonna dowithin that year, I wasgonna have to go back to work.And to me, that waskind of like a challengebecause I didn't wanna have to go back.I was like, I don't wanna fail at this.I don't wanna be like, I knewI was gonna start a business.I have no idea what.I had zero plan.I'm gonna start a business.I have always been really creativeand have a lot of great ideas,but had never pulled thetrigger on any of them.And so I was like,I'll figure something out.Like I'm gonna do something.And so I quit not with a plan.And thankfully this year will be 10 yearsand I haven't had to go back to work.That's awesome.I worked my ass off, butI'm gonna work for somebody.Yeah, yeah, yeah.But I mean, I thinkit's especially courageousfor a Gen Xer to do thatbecause we were raised in any wayto where we were entitledor allowed to feel specialin any way and any way.We were told we weren't special.Exactly.And we were not raisedto have high self-esteemand we were not raised to be confident.In fact, I think a lotof times our confidence,they tried to break it down.Like you were being toobully yourself for something,God forbid.So just the belief in yourself,you had to dig up to even take that stepbecause no one gave that to you.And so now you're 43,you haven't even gotten to thepoint where you're like at 50where you really startedto think about unravelingall the things andunpacking all the things.So I just think that's soimpressive at that stagein your life that you found that,you dug deep into your welland found that belief in yourselfto just take that leap of faith.I think that's so awesome, honestly.I don't think I could have done itif it hadn't been for Christa.She showed up for me,her and I had extremelydifferent upbringings.And so she grew up not in ahouse with domestic violenceand chaos and she hadmore stability in her home.And two parents and itdid eventually get divorcedbut she was an adult when they did.And so just a very different environment.And so she went to college,she had this, and Ireally struggled with thisfor a long time.When I met her, she wasworking on her masters.I felt very,it felt, I don't evenknow the word to describe it.I felt very out of my league and lessbecause I had never gone to college.And that held me back inmy career significantly.I could have gone much further in my careerbut it was always thedegree that held me backbecause they wanted it,even though you couldn'tteach what I knew in a book.That was not, but itwas just an expectation.That was a thing that our generationand the millennialgeneration was sold as a,you're going nowhere without a degree.And so I didn't have that.And so I always said, Ireally struggled with that.And remember thinking howmuch better she was than mebecause she had this master's degree.And that she was gonna go so much further.And so to have her in my corner going,you don't need that.Like you're so, you are so capableof doing all these other things.And she believed in me in a waythat I didn't even believe in myself.That gave me,I can't say she gave me the courage,but she definitely co-signed it in a waythat made me feellike, okay, I can do this.And she's gonna be there in mycorner while I figure it out.And so it's funny that this comes upbecause just today she texted me,because this is our 20th year together.We just got back from St. Martin last week.We went on a vacation,just the two of us for our20th with some friends of ours.And she just texted me this morningand was saying how she wasthinking about 20 years togetherand how when she first met me,that she kind of likestepped in in a way where,she got, she helped me with my son.He was going, he was graduating high schooland going into college.And I didn't understand that process.I had no idea what, howto get him into college.I hadn't had that experience.And so she was there in that wayand supported me when the moveto get to finally leave Toledoand go to Cincinnati andthen move to Atlanta with me.And she had always sort of supported meand then followed thatwith, and now she's like,I feel like I saved you, but she's like,now I look at where we are todayand I realize how much you saved me.And it was such an interesting contrastof like all the waysthat I have shown up for herand like our business now we have,I think she looks at it and thinksif I hadn't quit that job,we wouldn't be where we are.We wouldn't have thebusinesses that we havebecause we run, I own four businesses.And so, and we were juston Good Morning Americaat the beginning of July.Like there's just so manythings going on in our livesthat are really amazing things.And when you believe in yourselfand you have the rightpeople in your corner,I think you can do anything.And so I think that'swhat it boiled down tois that her being in my cornerand me believing that shewould support me no matter what,whether I wassuccessful at starting a businessor I failed at that miserablyand had to go back towork for somebody else,that she believed inwhatever that was and supported it.It was like, go for it, do it.Because she had a belief systemthat was very different than mine.She grew up in a different environmentthat did support her in that wayand did like give her, you know,granted she's got her owntrauma, her own baggage.But she just had parents who supported her.She played, she went tocollege on a scholarshipand played collegevolleyball for Notre Dameand like had all these thingsthat she was able to achieveand was proud of.And so she just had adifferent belief system of like,fuck that, you can dowhatever you wanna do.It doesn't matter what the piece of paper,fuck the piece of paper.Like that was how she approached it.And it just gave me this sense of freedomthat I didn't feel like I had.And the ability to say, you know what,I'm not really sure what I'm doing.I didn't know what I was doing.I'm not sure if I'm gonna succeed,but I'm gonna go for it anyway.Because I feel like I have this person.Even though I didn't have the safety netthat I talked about like financiallyand like that fear of ajob, especially medical,like not having health insurance.And there were all thesefactors that I had to weigh.But you know, it was again,just the belief that she had in methat I could do anything that was like,okay, even without that safety net,I feel a little safe with herthat she's got my back no matter what.And that's how it worked out.And well, she becamethe safety net in a way.You know, like- I still, yeah.I had some luck thereto catch me just in case.Just in case, but she also validatedthe dream you were about to partake in.She gave you that validation,which is another thingGen X never received.And so for her to justvalidate you as a personand just supported,she created space foryou to believe in yourself.I'm curious based on your background,was she the first person to like,maybe give you thatunconditional acceptanceand love and support?Yeah.You know, if I piece ittogether, chaotic life,you know, growing up,and now you're with her,you guys are 20 years in, which is amazing.Congratulations, that's fucking awesome.But was she that for you, I guess?Yeah, she really was.Like, I mean, Tony and I,you know, he's a great guyand we just kind of grew up and grew apart.It wasn't that he, he just,we were at youngerearlier phases of our lifewhere we were both trying tofigure out what we were doingand he was pursuing hiscareer and going to school.I mean, I didn't say,I can't say I let him.He went to college, you know,and, you know, I assumed the role of mom,I assumed the role of,you know, also workingand being helping toprovide and being a homemakerand all that shit that Ididn't really have anybody ever,I think, you know, in my cornerin the way that Kristahas that unconditional,there was always somelevel of expectation of me,I feel like, and so, yeah, I think thatas I've kind of looked over our 20 years,you know, she is just been there for mein a way that nobody ever had.And I think that you nailed it.It's that sort of unconditional,she takes me as I am,she knows I'm not perfect.You know, she doesn'treally expect more from methan what she's, know she's able to get.And it's, she's put up with a lot of shitthat I've had to work through.You know, I would say that, you know,she has, she picked onewith a lot of baggage.(laughing)She's been with you forall your bumps and bruises.Yeah, she's been there tocheer me on and encourage me.And, you know, even in my moments of crazy,because I have hadthem, she's just, you know,like I said, been there and supported mein a way that I didn't really,I've never had in my life prior.And so I think that's what's kept ustogether for 20 years.I'm the same for her.I'm a blue for her in a waythat's different than she is for me.But we just, yeah, somehowwe've held our shit together.Probably what makes it work.Yeah, we're very different people,but also we're very similar.And so yeah, we've justsomehow, I mean, look,20 years for me is like the 50 mark,where I'm like, holy shit,how the hell did we get here?Where the hell did 20 years go?You know, but that's through, you know,several moves andcareer change and businessesand children and college.And my, you know, mydaughter had, my 14 year old,she struggles withanxiety issues post COVID.So we, you know, we've beenthrough all of that together.And now social media and all of this chaosthat's come into her lifewith the tour that I'm on.And she's just, I'm suresometimes if I were her,I'd sit there and go, what thefuck is this life that I live?Does she swear?Yeah, not as much as I do, but she does.Everything is just a fact.She's a Gen X-er too.She might be seven years younger than me,but she still, she made it in.She's born in 79.I've been around some people.She just made it in.I've been around somepeople lately who don't swear.And I'm like, I don't know.I could trust people that don't say fuck.I just, I know.I agree.I agree.Everything you just described is marriage.Like everything youguys have done is marriage.And I always say that and Ithink it's such a beautifulthing because it'sgoing through ups and downs.It's building the life together.It's going through the baddays, months, weeks, years,whatever, but you, I dofeel you hit a point where it'slike, okay, yeah, we're doing this.You know, this is, we made it.We're doing it.Like we do marriage.Because it's not easy.No.You know, and at all,we're going on almost 31 yearsand honestly, when we hitthe 20 year mark is when I waslike, okay, yeah, I thinkwe know what we're doing.You go from what the fuckare we doing to, wow, 20.Okay.Like we're doing something, right?There's a lot of whatthe fuck are we doing?We don't know.Yeah, yeah, yeah.If you can get past the hard years, right?The years you raise your children,you get past the menopausal years.Now see, the good thing forher is that I've already beenthrough it and she's just starting.And so I have a lot moreunderstanding because notthat she wasn't, but shejust didn't know what was goingon either.She didn't know nobodywas talking about it.So I'm able to go, nah, that'sperimenopause right there.I'm able to see it and giveher where she's able to managethat a little bit better than I did.And I can also be more understanding.But yeah, I think if youcan get past the hard yearswith children, and there'sa lot of couples that comeout on the other side ofchildren, the empty nestersthat don't make it, right?I think is what happens is you find out,I think what happens oncekids are done and they move outand they go to college orwhatever they're gonna do,is you come into this space of like,do we still like each other?Do we know who we are anymore, right?You lose yourself so much in being parentsand being in whatever your career isand being whatever you'regonna be for your partnerand whatever.And so if you can come outon the other side of thatand still like each other, Ithink there's a lot of hopefor like, okay, we can dothis for another 20 years.And that's where we are.Our kids aren't fully grown yet,but we are definitely stillin a place where it's like,I still like you, eventhough, and it's really tougherfor us in a lot of waysbecause we also work together.We work together, we parenttogether, we do life together.And so sometimes I don't likeher and she doesn't like me,but at the end of the day,we do still like each other.And that is the bonus right there,is if you still love each other.That's marriage.Is she your best friend?Yeah, and that's why it works.We still like it.She is my best friend.She is absolutely my best friend.And I can't imagine doing life without her,which is nice that I stillfeel that way after 20 years.It's like, oh, I reallycan't imagine doing lifewithout you and don't want to.I don't want to gothrough life without her.So that makes it better too.Like, you know, I mean, Tony and I,we spent a lot of years together,but I don't think I ever once was like,oh, I don't know if Icould live without him.You know, that thing is I'm like,it was tough when we separated.He was my best friend as well.But like I said, we justkind of grew up and grew apart.And I think part of that wasjust because we were so young.We were young parents.You know, I was 16 when I got pregnant,had my kid at 17.He changed my, he,I really do attribute, you know,a lot of people could lookback and go, oh, she was 17.Like that had to betough in your life, you know,was forever altered away.My son saved my life.Like I look at where I was, if I had,I don't think if I'd have got pregnant,I don't think I'd be here today.I'd either be dead or in jail.And so that's the, that wasa big moment for me of like,Tony and I had this kidtogether, we were really young.And, you know, I look atJustin and go, he changed,he saved my life.Not only changed my life, he saved my life.And Tony and I, we stayedtogether as long as we coulduntil we couldn't, you know?And then it was just like,it wasn't good for Justinfor us to stay together.We just were not, you know,we just weren't compatible anymore.And so, but I love the factthat we were able to separateand still be friends.And so, you know, Tony, he's a great guy.And he's also with, I think,probably celebratingclose to 20 years with his,his wife.I think they got married,wife, girlfriend, partner,whatever the fuck she is.We're gonna get her a long time.Now you guys, do you live in the same areawhere Justin was able tostay at the same schooland everything as you've been?We did, we did then, yeah.Tony still lives up in,he's still a cop in Toledo.And Justin, my son liveshere in Atlanta where I live.He'll never be far from his mom.So he followed me here when he was--You did something right then, right?You can look at that and say he's nearby.So that's huge.Oh yeah, he finished, so hewas still living in Toledowhen I moved to Cincinnati.He stayed behind and lived with his dadto finish high school,because I gottransferred during his senior year.And so it was like, youstay and finish high school.So I moved to Cincinnati.Now when he started college,he started college in Toledo.He fucked off for thefirst six months of collegeand I threw all that money down the drainbecause I paid for college.And I was like, okay,if you're not actuallygonna apply yourself,then I'm not paying for collegeuntil you get your shit together.So you're gonna take out loansbecause I'm not gonnathrow out and throw away money.And so I also at the same time was like,I didn't really give him a choiceeven though he's a grown man.I was like, you're not staying in Toledo.Toledo is going to ruinyou, you're gonna go nowhere.It's a dead end.You're gonna move yourass, pack your shit upand move to Cincinnati andyou're gonna go to school here.And so I forced him to move to Cincinnatiand go to Northern Kentucky University,which is right acrossthe river from Cincinnati.So he went to NKU and then I gottransferred to Atlantaand he was still in college.And so he had to staybehind and finish school there.And then he moved herewhen he was done with college.And when he got here, he looked at me,he was like, if you moveagain, I'm gonna kill you.(laughing)And so we've stayed put hereand he is a middle schoolteacher going on 10 years nowas a middle school teacher.And he just finished his master's degreeand he's just doing, he's doing fantastic.That's wonderful.I always say middle schoolteachers are a special breed.I don't know how he does it.I don't either.I mean, it takes aspecial person to do that.So thankfully there arepeople like him out there,thankfully, but I couldn't do it.I give him mad props for that.I don't know.I told him, I don't even like kids enoughto even teach any grade.Well, I always say it's such a great signif your adult children wanna still see youand hang out with you.I think it's alwaysindicative of how you did as a parentand how much time and effort you put into them in their childhood.So that's a great sign foryou that he's staying closeand you're, you know, where you areand wants to still see youand be a part of the family.So that's a huge success.You broke the cycle.I did.I poured, I poured every,you know, when I had my son,I didn't really have, I didn't have many,like again, I was a young mom, 17,not even remotely close to figuringanything out in life.And, you know, I said he saved my life,but when he was born, Ijust remember looking at himand thinking, first ofall, this little person,this tiny little thing isdepending on me to like,I'm supposed to keep him alive.But I looked at him and thought,nobody's ever gonna hurt youand nobody's ever goingto make you feel less than.And I poured every singleounce of myself into that child.Even though I wasworked a lot and I was gonewhen he, when I was withhim, he never went without,he always knew he was loved.And yeah, he's, he is a mama's boy,even at 36 years old, he is a mama's boy.And I don't thinkhe'll ever be far from me.I think the coolest thingfor me is like looking at my,this 35 year old man, he's six foot three,200 pounds, 210 pounds, whatever,and think we're gonna grow old together.You know, that's kind of cool.Is it, when I was young,it seemed like a huge gap,but the older we get,the smaller that gap gets,you know, where I'm like, it's wild to methat I have a 30, soonto be 36 year old son.And he's starting tocomplain about aches and painsand his joints and shit.Welcome to old age.So that's kind of wild,you know, that we, I get,kind of cool also that I get to,I get to grow old withone of my kids, you know,the other two will be,there's a lot of years,21 years between my son and my second.How is their relationship?Oh, he, they love him.They adore him.He's a great big brother.Yeah, they're at their, theyalso are now getting older.And so when he comes around,he's starting to feelwhat I feel, which is,they're like, he, youknow, he's here high, you know,they're teenagers andpreteen and a teenager.So he's feeling a little bit of that,but he also is awarebecause he teaches middle school,how shitty that age is.They're just little assholes at that age.And so he's also aware ofthat, but no, they adore him.He's a, he, they love him.I love that they're, theyhave this really like big,big brother in their life, you know,that if anything shouldever happen to me, you know,they have him as well.And so, and that he's olderand he's wiser, kind of 35.The guys are still figuring it out at 35,but they just mature smaller.I don't know what it is, but you know,but he'll have this wisdomand he'll always look out forthem and I really love that.Now that's cool.Like with our 28 year oldson, I remember last year,he actually, he came overand we were talking, he goes,I think my frontal lobe closed.Like I feel different.I see the world differently.He's like, I think I'm understanding now.Yeah. Yeah.So it's, so he's 28 and Istill see he's working stuff out,but I did see thatshift where he's like, okay,I think I understandnow, like the adult thing.Cause I just see everything differently.I think my son's frontallobe may be closed then too,now that I think about you.Yeah.Yeah.This is a point wherehe said the other day,I just, things just feellike life has started, you know,coming together in a way that it never had.I'm like, welcome to 35.Like that's sort of the agewhere I feel like that beginsto happen for women, forme, it was like 33, 32, 33.I started to feel likethings were starting to sort ofbalance out a little bit, eventhough life was still chaoticcause when you're amom, life stays chaotic.But yeah, 35 is like, youcome into this space where yousuddenly feel wiser andlife calms down a little bit.And you start, he, himsaying, yeah, I don't really like,I'm not going to the clubs anymore.Like you stopped doing that, you know,you stopped going to the bar, like that,cause the hangoversucks, you know, whatever.He's in that point of hislife where I'm like, oh yeah,he's, he's here.That's great.So you have a millennial, you have amillennial too, Jamie.He was born in 1989, which is why.Wow.December 18th, very 1989.Yeah, very, so I'm like,oh, you're officially oldbecause you were born in the eighties.Yes.Technically.Did you have help when you first had him?Because he's come out well.You've come out well.Did I have help with raising him, you mean?Yeah, like, so in the beginning there,statistically at such ayoung age, that's hard, right?You were young having a, having a baby.Did you have help atthat time to, to kind of geton your feet and gethim kind of on his feet?No, I mean, Tony and Iwere on, we, we, we left,we got our ownapartment, like little apartment.We stayed with hisparents when I was pregnantand Justin was bornand within a few months,we, we did move out.Cause I left home when I was 16.I moved out of my houseat 16 and lived with himfor a short while and thenwe got our own apartment.But we just had a reallychaotic life where we gotan apartment and thenhe got, Justin was a babyand he got in an accidentand our car got totaled.Tony did, he couldn't work for like a year.So we had to move in withfriends and rent like a roomand then we got in, youknow, just, we had a lotof wild shit that happened to us.It didn't help ourrelationship because it was alwayssome sort of somethingalways setting us backand keeping us, holding us back financiallyor other crazy shit thatwould happen in our lives.So no, we just, Tony andI, and Tony was pursuinghis career in law enforcement.So I was kind of, eventhough we were together,I felt a lot like asingle parent where I was just,I was working andbeing the mom and the home.And you had no real model, right?No, nobody to model momafter, not the mom you wantedto be at least.No, I mean, I had a mom,but yeah, no, I didn't have,I didn't, I knew what Idid, I did essentially,I knew what I didn't want to be.The opposite, yeah, yeah.Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.And I'm sure, I mean, I know for myself,because I also come from afairly chaotic childhood,when I had our first child,something inside of me healed.There was just a part ofme that, not everything,but something that part of it healed.And also having him forcedme to get past certain things,at least to raise him.And that's probably whata lot of Gen X women dowhen they become mothers,is they kind of put their stuff on hold,because I'm gonna now raise these childrenand make sure I do it right.And I give them thatchildhood that I always wanted.And that brings us to then we're in midlifeand our kids are gettingolder and now we're like,okay, now I'll deal with these things.But I think we were so determined.I don't know if it's a choice even to like,okay, now I'll deal with these things.I think you're almost not,I think you're almost in a positionwhere you don't get a choice.Like you have to, you justhit a point where you're like,okay, now I have to deal with this.I've tabled this stuff for so long,because I had to assumethese other roles and identities.And honestly, I think Gen X,especially Gen X womenreally struggle with identity.We struggle to have anidentity outside of mom or daughteror caretaker, right?And so you get into this phase of lifewhere you're all of asudden like, who am I?Like, I don't know myselfand I have all this baggageand shit I didn't deal with.And now I feel like if you want to,if you want to be able to figure that out,you have to deal with that shit.You have to be able tofigure out who you are, right?And you're out your own identity.And I know for me,I was 50 years old going,I've never been anythingother than, well, at 43 really.I was like, I've neverbeen anything other than,when I first quit my joband trying to figureout what I was gonna do,I was like, well, what do you wanna do?I was like, I don't know.I don't have anidentity outside of being a momor an investigator.Like I don't know how to do anything else.I didn't think I did,and I didn't think I was good at anything.And so even now at 52, Istill sometimes am like,I'm still just a mom anda wife and a caretaker,but now content creator, andapparently now also comedian,which was new,there's just all thesethings where I'm like,still trying at 52 tofigure out my own identity.And I think a lot of womenour age struggle with that.But you're doing it on your terms now.Yeah.And it's on your foundation.And it's completely present.Yeah, and I hope that,I wish that for not just Genex women,I wish that, I mean, Iwish that for anybody.Everybody deserves that.Everybody deserves toarrive at a point in lifewhere you're like, yeah, I know who I am.And I like who I am,and I'm okay with where I'm at,and I'm living in themoment, enjoying life,what life has to offer me right now.I'm not gonna say tomorrow,not what happened yesterday, but right now.What was the first business you startedafter you had left your career?I started a boutique, a clothing boutique.And so that, Feather & Vine has been aroundgoing on 10 years,it'll be close to 10 years.Online or brick and mortar?Online, yeah, I know.I have zero desire toown a brick and mortarthat's a little too much commitment for meto show up and be in a building every day,unlock a door and show up.I didn't wanna do that, but yeah.Online, and then about five years ago,for my boutique, Istarted a skincare company.I thought I wouldexclusively carry in my boutique.And now my skincare company is hands downthe biggest brand of the two.It's now not onlyexclusively at Feather& Vine,it's its own brand.And that's what we wereon Good Morning Americaa couple of weeks ago, July 2nd actually.And we might be on someother shows here soon.And so Wholesome Hippie,which is my skincare company,is an all natural wellness companythat we make right here in Georgia.And so we have wellness andbeauty and that's my baby.That's what I pouredmy heart and soul into.So what is, how would youdescribe what Feather& Vine is?What do you sell in your boutique?So it's mostly a clothing boutique.Like now currently in the beginning,we sold all kinds of stuff,but we sell denim and shoes,but we also own our own T-shirt machine.So we make these for the Genex takeover,but we make our own shirts and hoodies.We've sold everything and anything,especially during COVID, during COVID.We were almostcompletely unaffected by COVIDbecause we've been inthe live selling businessfor a long time.That's how we started was we would go liveand sell, try clothes onand sell them that way.And so when COVID came around,we were a lot of people's entertainment.Like they were tuning in,because we have our own app and stuff,and they were tuning in,like, oh, can you guys just go live?Cause they felt lonely.They were home themselvesand they couldn't go out.And so we were in theirliving rooms every day,Chris and I, you know,trying on clothes and selling.Now we just, we got intoselling all kinds of wild shitbecause we could, like they were just,they're like, can you get this?And can you get this?Cause they couldn't go out and shop orcouldn't do whatever.So we got into selling foodand snacks and kitchen shitand all kinds of wild stuff.It was wild, the stuff that we got intoand Christmas decor andHalloween and all this stuff.And so now we dialed it back,back to just a clothing boutique.And we sell Wholesome Hippiealso through Feather and Vine,but Wholesome Hippie, it's its own,it's its own thingseparately from Feather and Vine.So.What was your motivationto start Wholesome Hippie?It really came out of myown skin, my own needs.So I'd spent, you know, I've always had,I always had really sensitive skin.I had eczema horribly as a child.And it really sucked to have it as a kidbecause this was duringa time when we didn't,we were poor, we didn't own a dishwasher.I was the dishwasher and I was reallyallergic to dish soap.And so I would break outlike from here to here,washing dishes.And I just always hadreally sensitive skin.I eventually outgrew the eczema side of it,but I didn't outgrow the sensitivity.So as I just, youknow, I got into my fortiesand it still was washing my facewith a bar of caress or dove soapbecause nothing, I couldn'tuse anything else on my skin.It would break me out or burn me.All the stuff I would buylike at the store to try.I was always like, I wantedto have a skincare regimen,but I didn't.And so I wasn't reallybeauty in the beginning.I, you know, my mom, she hadbeen in the apothecary businessfor over 30 years.And I grew up with herbeing sort of crunchy granolaand in the wellness space.What people would think wasreally woo woo at the time,you know, essentialoils and shit like that.And so I kind of knewa little bit about it.And a friend of mine whowas in the boutique businessis the one, he started askincare brand for himself,Wellness, and he was like, you reallyshould check this out.You should think about this.And I was like, I know I'm notgoing to use any of that stuffbecause my skin is so sensitive.He was like, you just need to try it out.Well, I didn't.But I tuned into one ofhis live shows one daybecause the boutique space is really small.We're all very interconnectedand you know a lot of people.And he had had the manufacturer, thismanufacturer on there,and listening to hertalking about ingredientsand how the products and stuff,reminded me a lot of mymom and how my mom was.And I was like, oh, this lady,she actually knowswhat she's talking about.She got my attention.So so much that I was like,I don't want to talk to her.I want to talk to her.I want to ask some questions.And that's how whole hippie was born.Because I got her on the phone.I talked to her.She sent me some samples.And initially, it was like,she was like, what ailmentsdo you have?And I struggle with migraines.At the time, I had really bad--I was having perimenophiles.I was having terriblemigraines and pain, joint pain.She's like, let me send you some stuff.And I talked to her aboutthe fact I had XM as a kid.So our early products were likewellness, head rescue, ecstemarescue, stuff for pain.And then slowly, she chipped awayat me, where she was like, you reallyshould try-- consider some beauty products.And I was like, nope,that's where I draw the line.My face is very sensitive.And even though it's allnatural, clean ingredients,made in small batches, all that, I wasstill really hesitant.But she's like, let mejust send you some samples.And let me know what you think.So she did.And I fell in love with it.It was the first time in mylife that my skin, my face,felt like it had somethingthat was not going to burn me,not going to break me out.And our beauty line was born,and multiple beauty lines now.But looking back, I look atpictures of today of my skin,especially my face, like six years ago.And I looked older then than I do now.And it's just because I actually startedtaking care of my skin.Most people think of theirskin as like an afterthought.Like you think aboutwhat you put in your body.But a lot of people don'tthink about what they put on it.And what you put on your body goes in.And so anyway, yeah, wemake a lot of wellness productsand beauty stuff that's clean that peoplecan feel good about putting ontheir skin or on their family.And that's how in Wholesome Hippie,we went viral onTikTok with our Calm Cream.Magnesium creams is really what--I mean, we were on the map.But that really put us on the map,is our magnesium creams and stuff.And so yeah, we've justbeen slowly building this brandinto something that is like a people loveand can't live without.And we saw you on Good Morning America.You did.Yeah, we did.That's awesome.Thank you.You did a good job.You did a great job.Yeah, no, it was nerve-wracking.I mean, there was a huge commitmentto be on there inventory-wise.You have to commit a lot of inventoryto do a segment like Deals and Steals.And so I was really nervous.I was like, oh my god, don't fuck this up.This is a big moment.And it went well enough thatthey just reached out recentlyto ask us if we might consider being on oneof their other segments.So--Oh, that's true.Congratulations.Thank you.You did great.You did wonderful.You were seamless.Thank you.And I know you had to have been so nervous.I was nervous.I don't get nervous easily.I'm pretty cool andcollected most of the time.But that did have me nervous.I had to be therereally early in the morning.I'm sorry.Clock, I'm in New York City.Krista booked the hotel.So GMA, they just recentlymoved out of the building.They'd been in for, I don'tknow, a fucking decade or longer.If you've ever watchedit where they're like,you can see the peoplelooking in through the windows.They moved from there over to another placein Greenwich Village.And so Krista booked a hotel by whatshe thought was the GoodMorning American Building, whichwas literally a blockdown from where I was saying,which was the old building.So that made it extra nerve-wrackingbecause I get there thinking, she's like,you're going to be good.You can walk to the place.Well, then I get there.My friend from New Jerseypicks me up, my friend Marina,to take me into thecity because I was like,Krista didn't come with me.And I was like, I can'tgo into the city by myself.I can't go anywherewithout being approached.I get recognized in public a lot.And so I was like, I can'tgo to New York by myself.Marina will take you.So my friend Marina comes in from Jersey,takes me to New York.So she's like, that's not the building.And I was like, Krista said she booked usright by the building.She's like, that's the old building.So she looks like it's2 and 1-1-2 miles away.We had to get up at 4o'clock in the morning.So we could be ready so we could get a cabbecause it's New York City.Unless you're within walkingdistance, traffic is a bitch.So we had to get up really early,get a cab to get over to Greenwich Villageto get there in time.Because I had to be there at 6.30.6.30 was the latest you could be there.So that you could go on for the segmentthat we had to start likedo our run through at 7.30.And so yeah, I was like,by the time we actuallygot out there on the stageand everything was going, I was like,I was nervous as shit.I mainly, first was beingnervous about being on time.I was so afraid to be latebecause of traffic or whatever.And so anyway, I was just glad.I was like, whatever you do, just don't,don't swear and just saywhat you're supposed to sayand shut your mouth.You did great.You really did.And you looked great.In fact, it was sofunny because we were in,was that on a, wasn'tit on a weekend, right?It was on a weekend.It was on a week.It was on a weekend.It was like a Thursday and a winter.It was on a week. It was like a Thursday and a winter.It was like a week before 4th of July, July 2nd.Okay.Okay.Okay, so we hadn't gottenout of bed yet, I don't think.It was early.And so I'm scrolling on Instagram, I think,and you had put up, you're about to go on.So we quickly turned it on andBrian hit record just in case.And I said, I think we missed it.And then they said, it's coming up.I'm like, oh my God, we didn't miss it.So, and then we ordered too.We ordered, let me-What did you guys get?What did you order?The magnesium.Oh, I missed it.Listen, that's right there.Pain, restless leg, muscle cramps, nausea,sleep, it can help us know many things.Yeah.And then the cold for the migraine.That's good shit.Yeah, no, I want to order more stuff.It's great.So yeah, we were so excited.I was nervous for you.I was nervous because I was like,obviously we don't know each other,but I was like, I hope shedoes well and you killed it.Yeah.You really did a good job.We were super excited to be invited.We've also been submitted.I don't even know if I can say this,because I don't know if we'll get on.We hired a PR companyand she just recently,you have to submit.We were submitted to be partof Oprah's favorite things.So we're hoping maybe for holiday,we'll be part of Oprah's favorite things,but they only pick somany and you have to submitand like whatever.So we haven't heardback on that yet, but yeah.No, I was nervous.I'm not nervous, like I said, easily.And that was the first time in a long time.I've been like reallynervous where I was like,good, now we were on GMA last year,but it was not deals and steals.It was here in Atlanta.It was a collaboration with Chase Bank.Chase had reached out to us and said,cause we're one of their customers,would you want to do this segment?And we were like, sure.And so it was just like aquick, not a deals and steals.They were just featuring like businessesof like the Chase Bankcustomers and businessesthat were Atlanta based.And so it was like avery quick little 15 second.It was nothing major.So I had already kind of been through that,but the production hereremote is very differentthan the production in the studio.And so that was very differentwhere it was like much bigger.And, but I took it to meetRobin Roberts and Tori Johnson.And so Krista was super jealous.She's like, I didn't, she's texted me.I didn't know you weregoing to meet Robin Roberts.I didn't either.I had no idea.She was standing right next to me.I gave her a jar of calm cream, you know?She loved it.But yeah, I know I'm glad.It was as soon as it was done,I was glad that it was over.Like, that's the mother.Yeah. It's like, whoo.Yeah. And there was a dog there too.Before your segment, like somebody hadtheir puppy on, right?Yes.Yeah.All kinds of wild shit.And then in that building,they shoot Good Morning America,the view and the Mark and Kellyshow all in the same building.Oh, wow.So yeah, there's a lotof shit going on in there.And, you know, but I know morethan walked into the elevatorand one of the peoplethat worked there was like,Oh my God, I love your videos.Oh, that's awesome.I literally can't go anywhere.Not I can't.It's, but it's wonderful stuff.I mean, I love meetingpeople, depending on where I'm at.Sometimes not so much.I'm like, if I'm at thedoctors, that's a little weird.You know, but causeI've been in the dentistand they're like, I love your videos.Well, I got shit in my mouth.That's a little bitweird, but, or your, or your,or your, your techthat's cleaning your teeth.There's talking about video.That's happening.But now it's good.It's good stuff.No, I'm sure it's super cool.Okay. So you have feather and vineand you have wholesome, wholesome hippie.What's your third business?Slim Sherry is my third business.Okay. So content cream, right?Yeah.So when, when did that start?That it'll be four years in Novemberthat I started making content.Yeah. So about threeand a half years right nowthat I've been actively making content.Yeah.And I, and you alluded to this earlier,but your inspiration to start this accountand start putting up these videos,was it to connect Gen Xers or was it like,what, where, how did this start?I like so many otherpeople got COVID in 2021.And I was just laying in bedconstantly scrolling TikTok.I had never been on TikTok before that.I didn't even know what the hell it was.And that, you know, it waseverybody at that time was like,it's just a kids, a kidsapp, dance trends and shit.So I found myself scrolling.And what I discoveredwas it wasn't just that.There was like so muchmore happening there.And there were people that Iwas listening to where I waslike, oh, this is actuallymore than just dance trends.And I remember thinking I could do this.Like I think I could do this.And so that might'vebeen the drugs talking.I don't know. I waspretty sick for a while.I was, I'd been in bed, I,I bed for like a month and,and at one point was liketelling Chris to check my willkind of shit.Like it was, I was pretty sick.But anyway, you know, that,that's sort of like a near deathwhere you're like, okay,let my life needs to really change.That's, that's a storyfor after that later on.But anyway, I was laying there justscrolling and thinking,I could do this.I thought initially Iwould use it for my business.So I was like, I think Icould do this and, you know,promote my business or whatever,but it just never turned into that.I don't know what happened.I didn't, I had no idea what I was doing.I look back at myearly videos and I'm like,these are fucking cringy as shit.So cringy.I didn't know what I was doing.I was trying to learn thetechnology and I made a fewvideos, nothing, nothing Gen X related.And I don't really rememberhow the Gen X thing came up.People ask me all the time.And I'm like, you know, before TikTok,I never identified as a Gen Xer.Like that was not in our vocabulary.Like we, not a generationthat walked around callingourselves Gen X or likethat was more millennial thing.I feel like we, we, wecalled them millennials,but we, we were not anything.And so that was new to me.And I don't know if I, maybesomebody came up on my feedand they were talkingabout Gen X or something,but I'm, you know,maybe I was looking back.I'm like, I think maybe Iwas like, oh, that's me.Like that's my generation,but they weren't talkingabout anything significant.It was probably like a, just a dumb video,but I remember thinking that's me.And I one day made a video of a call,it was called the sounds only Gen X years,which was just like opening notes to songsthat we all would know.And it was, you know, Ididn't had zero expectationcause all my videos upto then had done nothing.Like they were just like,I didn't think anybody wasever going to watch them.And so I post this videosounds only Gen X years,which is like opening notes.That's the kind of likea dog whistle, you know,where it's like, oh,and I post that video.I went to bed, I wake up the next dayand that video had gone viral.And I picked up like40,000 followers overnight.And I was like, whoa.Like I didn't know what to do with that.And so being aninvestigative mind, I was like,oh, I need to knowmore about how this worksbecause now, you know, I don't know,I don't know what to dowith all these people.And so I went down the rabbithole and I did the research,you know, andeverybody at the time was like,oh, you have to be, you have to niche down.You have to, you know,make, pick a niche and get in itand the algorithm will love you for it.So early on, I just startedmaking a lot of Gen X videosand they were funny videos, just, you know,kind of like the soundsonly Gen X years until,I mean, I fell into thattrap of like niche down.And so I was only making early on,a lot of my videos were just Gen X videos.And I get bored really easily.And so I was like, I can't just talk,I can't just do this forever.So I started getting, going deeper.I started talking about more taboo topicswhen it comes to Gen X and really kind of,I also was going through that phase, right?I said, I was turning 50, you know,and that sort of unraveling.And so I started chipping away a little bitat some of those topics and maybe traumasand people, it resonatedand the followers juststarted to grow even more so,like even, you know, just,they were coming out of the woodwork.And then I started talking about midlifeand aging and menopause and, you know,all these things thatreally just are hittingin all the places where we are, you know?And I feel like I was just not in, not,wasn't accidental, but italso wasn't intentional,where I just feel like Iwas meeting a lot of peoplein places where they needed to be met.And they were like, youare the voice, you know,that I needed.And you say all thethings that I'm thinking.And you nail it, like,you know, you get me.And I think some people, they just want,they just want to be feel seen, you know,they just want to feel heard.And first, a lot of people,they feel like I give wordsor credence to whatthey feel and how they feeland they feel validated.And so, and they also don't feel so alone.And so that kept me going,you know, that kept me going.And now three and a half years later,I have over 6 millionfollowers across the, you know,all the differentplatforms, which is wild to me.And I don't take that for granted ever.Like I show up every day,whether I want to or not,you know, even if it'sjust reposting a video,maybe from that I did a year ago, you know,so I show up every day,even if I don't havethe capacity creatively,or my mental space is not right.Just because so manypeople tell me they need it.You know, like, I needa dose of you every day.They need, whether it'sto laugh about somethingor maybe they're gonna cryor maybe I'm givingthem a little tough lovebecause now I'm at thepoint where I do deliver,my daily dose of Slim Sherries came aroundas like sort of this voicethat I wanted to give to peoplethat I wish I had had, you know,that somebody who issaying the things to youthat you really need to hear,that you maybe are not, you're not,you won't pay attention to unlesssomebody's kicking youin the ass, you know, like, listen,don't you scroll past me.This is what I have to say to youand to give them something to think about,you know, give themsomething to reflect on.That's what I hope for.And so I show up, I tryto show up every single daywith some sort of intention,whether sometimes it'sjust a video with musicwith me doingsomething because I don't have,it takes a lot tocreatively show up like thatevery single day for peopleand the heaviness thatcomes with our generation.I don't think a lot ofpeople ever have connectedthose dots of like howheavy it is sometimesto read those comments and absorb.I'm in Pafek, so I absorb a lot of energy.And so that's not easy tocarry that weight sometimes.So sometimes I'm like,I can't, I can't read,like somebody said otherday, said, I left a comment.I was on a podcastyesterday and she's like,I commented on your video.And I was like, that's really sweet,but I'm gonna be really honest and tell youthat I probably will never see it.One of two reasons, Iget thousands of commentsand I try to read a lot ofthem, but sometimes I don't,I can't, I have to protect myself and just,depends on the video.Some videos I'll never read one commentbecause I know as soon as I post it,it's going to be inundated and floodedwith just this sadness and traumathat our generation carries around.Yeah, that makes, andwell, you, with those videos,you're creating a spacefor them to be able tomutually share in thecomments and relate with each other.And it's almost, you'renot even probably neededto be in there because asthey relate with each other,you've created the space andthey can kind of run with it.And they do.And I'm not, yeah.And the chat is there.It's so much healinghappens in those momentsthat I don't, you're right, Idon't have to be present for.Right, you've done your, you've done enoughjust by giving them the space.And I think it's interestingwhat you said is that you gavea name to, they said, you'vejust said what I'm feeling.And how we talked about no onehelped Gen X define emotions.No one helped Gen Xdefine what they were feeling.No one helped us withour emotional development.And so you are also finally helping,I think a lot of Gen Xersdefine what they're feelingfor the first time maybe in their life.And that's really powerful.Yeah, and that alone isworth doing what you're doing.Just that you're helping,because with all of that,you're helping people heal.But I hear what you're saying,because especially now thatyou have such a vast audience,that's a lot of energy coming your way.It is.Especially if you absorb it.And so in order to, and Ican't imagine having to come upwith new content daily,because that's a part of yourself.You're taking a part of yourself andputting it out there.And I'm sure you have to be carefulthat you don't dry the well.Yeah.That you protect yourself.It is a balance.In the beginning, it was a lot easier.It's harder now, threeand a half years in, right?Like I have touched on a lot of topics.There's a lot of habit.There are certain topics Ihave completely just not touched.I don't know if it's my own trauma responseto not touch them, orif it is that I'm fearof what it will trigger in others.So I've been very, I'mvery mindful and cautiousof those delicate topics,but there's so much morethat I could talk about.But there is a balancethat I've had to strikeof like early on, it was easy to fire offwith all this stuff, right?And now three and a half years in,I see the effect that I have.I see the impact.I see the aftermath in the comments.And I'm just, I'm more carefulbecause I wanna be veryintentional and help people,not ever hurt people.And I think for some GenXers, some of the topicsthat I've touched on,touches something deep inthem that they're not ready for.And so it has caused me, like I said,there's been moments where I've pausedand that's, I think alot of what I'm gonna saveand I'm working through inmaybe pouring into my book.Because there are peoplewho do want and ask me often,like they get little 30second or 60 second videos of me,maybe a minute and a half.It's rare that I'll postanything longer than that.And so I had a lot of people go,how do I get long form, Sherry?Like where do I get that?Cause there's so much more therethan what I can shoveinto a one minute video.And so it's, that's been the work of like,okay, trying to figure out how to,I never went to college.I've never written a damn thing in my lifeother than a check and trying to figure outhow to write a book, it's challenging,but I'm workingthrough it and trying to givesome longer form,whether that be through writingor other means doingpodcasts, things like that,to give people an opportunity to hearbeyond the funnyversion of Slim Sherry, right?Or the, what theyconsider their Gen X queen,which I never signed up to be that.Have you found that as your content,as you have added in, Keelene,unpacking trauma, midlife,talking about menopause, premenopause,have you found that any of your audiencehas kind of rebelled against some of thatand just likes the Gen X is toughand we don't care aboutanything and we don't do trauma.Have you found a little rebellionas you've brought updeeper topics, I guess?Sure, sure.Yeah, you see it.I don't tend to pay much attention to it.I recognize that I havethis very broad audiencewhere in the beginningit might've been very,like a lot of Gen X, right?But now I've picked uppeople that are menopause,perimenopause, peoplethat are just think I'm funnyor motherhood orwhatever reasons that they came.And there are some, yeah, that will tell,like especially Gen X will be the firstto open their damn mouths.We're the ones that arebasically like, shut the fuck up.Like we're be the first to tell you that.We open our mouths quicker than anybody.Where we'll tell our opinion and we do,so they drop their little shit bombsa lot of times in thecomments where they do tell me like,if I talk about something they don't like,I only like you and you're funny.They don't like the serious side of me.Just go back to being funny.Great, I'm just a puppet.I do whatever you tell me to do.So there's those, then there's thosethat are basically like, stop whining.Why are you talking about that?Because they're, they're notready to deal with their shit.Or the ones that, you know, basically,essentially are the I don't give a fuck.Like you, you know, whatever.Like they don't wantyou talking about anythingthat's other than justthe nostalgic side of Gen X.Like I only like youwhen you give me memoriesthat remind me of a timethat doesn't exist anymore.That's essentially, I've gota big group of those people.But for the most part,the majority of themtake me for all parts of me.Like they love all of it.They're like, I don't care.You could make anythingand I will listen, you know?And so, but there is some of that.And I've learned in the beginning,I let those people get to me.I let them influence my choicesin what kind of content I would makeand how I would show up.And now I say, fuck you,I would do what I want.Because I've learnedthat, you know, if you don't,if you don't like, and I tell people,if you don't likesomething that I make, that's fine.I don't care.I'm not everybody's cup of tea.And I'm not gonna beeverything you need me to be every day.That's okay, you can just scroll past.But if you feel the needto pause and let me knowthat you don't like something about me,or you only want me to be one way for you,like whatever that is,whatever it is, your expectations of me,I don't have time for that.And in that case, you can just unfollow.In some cases, I help them unfollow.I block them.Because I'm like, you know what?I don't need that kind ofenergy in the comment sectionfor me or for the peoplethat are enjoying the content.Because those people,they're just some of some,unfortunately, what Ihave discovered about,especially our generation and boomers.I told you, there's the boomer lights.I see them on one of mycomments, let me tell you,I see them a lot.Where, you know, like I said,I used to let them get to me,but I've learned to ignore it.I've learned to, in somecases, back to what you said,is I'm providing a space for them toexpress certain thingsand emotions and have acommunity and dialogue.And as long as they keep it,like not, you know, I don't tolerate peopletearing each other down.And that, I see happen,depending on the topic,happens very quickly, like afucking bunch of wild wolf.Yeah, it's wild.It's crazy.It's crazy to watch.And I hate that becauseI'm like, you know what?That is not, you guys missed the point.You missed the point of the video.You know, and so I'llhave to go through sometimesand filter or block or delete peoplefor that kind of behavior.And I hate doing that becauseI don't want to be the personthat polices what other people do,but there are hateful people in the world.So I do sometimes have to manage that.But for the most part, Ilike to just put it out thereand let them have that.Because sometimes itmight just be, you know,it could be the day they're havingor they have something theyneed to get off their chest.And so I hate being theperson that would, you know,in any way limit that.But social media is a wild, wild space.And you have to proceed with caution.Because it is a crazy place.Yeah, I mean, as far asthe way I try to look at itthat's helped me not be affected is,as long as what we're creating is authenticand coming from a good place,and we're putting it outthere with good intentions,once it's out there,it's really none of our business anymore.And if there'shatefulness coming off of someone,they're just projectingwhat's inside of them.It has nothing to do with us.And that's how I'm looking at it.So none of it affectsme if that makes sense.That's a good way to look at it.I mean, I think I've gotten to there.It didn't in the beginning.In the beginning, it didn't, like I said,I did allow it to steer meor deter me, if you will,from certain things.But now I'm like, no,it's my space, my channel.If you don't like it,you don't have to be here.And I love the ones thatlike to tell me they're leaving.(laughing)I'm unfollowing you.Okay, you don't need to,this is not an airport.You don't need toannounce your departure by,they want you to knowthat you pissed them offand they're leaving.Like a child slamming a door,so stupid.Like, how old are we, for God's sakes?It's like, thank you for the engagement.Yeah, I'm like, yeah, thankyou for leaving this here.It's for my algorithm.Yeah, exactly, no.So, well, I mean, it's just, I love,I've always loved the stuffyou put out, it's awesome.And I love how you've usedyour space and your platform.And like, we've only really been,we've been doing this less than a year.So our exposure to this is brand new.And so I give you a lot of credit.You've been doing this now for three yearsand you have such a huge audience.And like I said,I can't imagine theenergy that comes towards you.Cause like you mentioned,even when you're in public,there's always that kind of riskthat you're going tohave energy coming at you.And so the fact thatyou've been able to figure outhow to balance that is commendablebecause that can throw people off mentally.It, you know, mentally,I think I've kept myselfin a pretty good space.It was weird in public, the first,I don't know, a hundredtimes somebody came up to me.It was a little weird.Cause you know, youdon't know what to expect,especially when about myself, you know?I mean, I've never encountered anybodythat's been harmful to me in any way,but you never know, right?Like there are people who don't like me.They let me know, they don't like me.Like, I never knowwhat your intentions are.Mentally, I have, in thebeginning, like I said,I struggled initially.I figured that out pretty quickly of like,how to make sure I protect myselfand my own mental health,because I am a work in progress.And I was like, I can'tallow that in my space.And so, you know,being a big energy person,I manage that, but I commend you guys.You've only been doing thisyear, you're doing fantastic.I think it's, you guys are-Thank you.Next month, the end ofnext month is a year for us.So yeah, it's been,it's been awesome and so much-Can I ask what got you started?Like what made you want to do it?It's very similar to what you mentioned.We turned 50 and we, like you,I want to be alive until I'm a hundred.I envisioned that.I think 50 is midlife.And we both kind of lookedat each other and we thought,okay, we say we want to do these things.And if we're going to dothem, it's now or never.We're going to either do it or we're not,but we all facing your mortality.That was huge.Knowing that there's afinite, there's finite.This is finite.And so we thought, why not?Our first motivation waslet's get our stories downand our thoughts onthings for our children,their children, their children.So like, I think it'd beso cool if I could go backand see what my great,great, great grandmother thoughtabout relationships or, you know, anything.I would just love to hear her voiceand see what she looks like.So we thought, let's get us down.So if nothing comes of it, the kids have itand future generations have it.And we'll just talk toeach other about stuff.And then we were like, this is great,but we'd love to give thisplatform for other peoplefor the same reason, for their generationsto be able to have theirfamily's life story recorded.And then also we took it a step furtherby us sharing and our guest sharing.It could help people feel seen.It could help people feel heard.It could help people feel not so alone,especially people that live in rural areasthat maybe don't haveanyone to talk to about anythingor in other countries thatmaybe don't have, you know,you don't know withcultures and everything,there could be somethingone of our guests could saythat you just don'tknow who you're gonna reachand it could be life changeand it could change thetrajectory of their life.You could validate someone.You could encourage them, inspire them.So then we said, let's open this upwhere people come on andshare their life stories thus farbecause it's always going and fluid.And it kind of just took off.So something in there resonated obviously.But like I said, we alwaysmake sure everything we dois authentic and real, andit's coming from a good placeand good intentions.We don't force anything.And we think, you know,everyone's story is valuableand has meaning and has thepotential to reach someone.I think when I first,that's probably what I connected with.I don't resonate withpeople that come across as fakeor inauthentic or that vibe is not for me.And you guys, I got a vibefrom you that wasn't that.And that's probably what drew me to youwhen you first were coming up in my feedwhen then you continued to come upbecause I was engaging with your videos.And so every time I sawyou, I wasn't disappointed.I think there needs to be more of that.I think that when youthink about the internet,I guess the internet is a wild place.What it's lacking, whatpeople are really growing tired ofand what you guys are hitting on,I think if you're finding that success,it's because people aretired of the perfectly curated,like fake, you know,disingenuine world of social media.That's why I know that'swhy people resonate with me.It's the real, I say thethings that people wanna say,but they're afraid to say.I talk about things thatpeople want to talk about,but don't.And I do it in a waythat's authentic and real.I'm just who I am.And I'm not gonna sugarcoat for youbecause it makes you feel better.It doesn't make me feel better.So I talk a lot aboutnot contorting yourselfinto those boxes anymore, right?You just get to a pointwhere you're like, fuck that.That box never fit me.And I like to spill out over the top.So here you go, this is me.And yeah, I think that'swhat a lot of more people,I think those are the nextrising stars in social media,are those people that nail the authenticityand the showing up as whothey are every day regardless.They just are who they are.And people appreciate that.That sort ofexpectation of that perfect worldof social media is really disappearing.And so before you're resonatingbecause you are connecting on those levelsthat people are, that they desire.Which is right.And authenticity, real talk.You're touching on topics that other,they wanna talk about,but other people aren't talking about.That's what people want.I don't think eitherone of us could performin any way like that, right?We are who we are, it is what it is.Yeah. Yeah.And you have to go intoit as you're enjoying itand this is meaningful to you.So it almost doesn't matterhow anyone else receives it.In a way you can't, at least for us,we couldn't go into itwith any expectations.You know, it's just, it iswhat it is, we're doing it.And then if it ends up positively awesome,and we love that, but no matter what,we're gonna stay trueto what we've been doing.We're not gonna alteranything to fit anything.That's good.And I think that's wherethings get a little weird is,and you know, and youhave to keep a level head.Well, you start seeing videos that do wellin a certain tone or whatever,but I think our goal is to stay the course.Stay the course, not--I think what you're doing--Yeah, you guys aredoing it right, so don't,I mean, alter if you want to.Yeah, yeah.So you alter because you want to,not because somebody, notbecause some trend tells you,or you know, that's amistake a lot of people make,is they'll see a video thatpops off for whatever reason,and they're like, they chased that.You know, and it's like, don't, that is,and then they wonder why it doesn't work,because that was a one-off.Like, you never know whatthe algorithm is gonna do,or what it's gonna popoff, and so don't chase it,just be you.And so I love that you guys are that,and I'm not being performative,which, you know, in all honesty,and I don't say this enough,I probably should say it more,although it'll piss people off,is Gen X is one of themost performative generations,I think, out there.We put on the show better than anybody.Fake it till you make it.That was our mantra.I think you're right.I hadn't thought of it that way.And so I think thatthere are a lot of peoplethat appreciate those of us that are like,fuck that mask, fuck that performing,I'm gonna just be me,and they see something in usthat they wish for themselves.And so that's why youkeep doing what you're doing,because that's why you resonate,because there are a lot of them that wishthey could be that, andthey aren't there yet,or they maybe will never get there.It's such a good point,because I think Gen X had to mask,and had to, and never feltsafe to be their authentic selves.And then now they've gonethrough all these things,and now they're hitting midlife,and it's such a process tofind your authentic self.And not every, as you just said,not everyone's ready to do that,not everyone knows even which step to take.And so when they comeacross something like that,even if it just helps them through the day,like what you do for people,just you're helping themget through the day with that.Even if they're stillhaven't taken that step,you're an example ofmaybe what their goal is,or they're shootingfor, they hope to get to.So I think that's such a great point.I never thought about that about Gen X.Yeah, we are the most, in my opinion,performative, because we had to be.And when you strip that down,you had mentioned itearlier about so many of us,because we weren'tallowed to have feelings,a lot of us aren't evenaware of what we're feeling.And so when you look atthis performative maskthat we've worn and the suppression ofemotion and feelings,and not knowing how to process any of that,then when you seesomebody that's showing up,like I said, as their authentic selves,that's your age and has asimilar maybe experience in lifeor has had shared experiences of some sort,and also seems to have their shit together.I don't have my shittogether if anybody wants to know.But a lot of people think I do.I think it just makes, itstops them in their tracksand they're like, they disconnect in a waythat is, they wouldn't have otherwise.And I think it makes them more opento receiving the message.Social media haspresented this opportunity,I think unique for ourgeneration, not really unique,but I think it's a little bit unique,because we come from aworld where we didn't have that,but now we get thisdoorway into like this worldof all these other people's worlds.And we come from a timewhere if we weren't face to face,we didn't have the experience, right?You had to be there or you missed it.And so now you get thisglimpse into all these other worldsand all these otherpeople and all their emotionsand how they're processingand how they're doing lifeand whatever, and some of ityou look at it and you envy it,and you wish you could have it,and some of it you look atand go, yeah, that's not for me.And then some of it you stop and go,wow, this actually is helpfuland might change your trajectory.And that's what I hope to do for peopleis just maybe make thempause and go, yeah, I can change,I can be different than I am today.It's interesting, because it's almost likeit just doesn't have to be this way.Here's somebody doing it differently.You can kind of, there are other waysto do this thing we're all doing.And I think the social mediahelps you kind of get there.You know what's interesting is that no one,no one ever gave us those options.No one ever talked to us about that.No one ever introducedother options or pathwaysor different decisionswe can make, choices.It's almost like nowthat we're hitting midlife,some of us are offering that to our peers.We're saying you can do this.You don't have to justbe like this anymore.You could choose this.There is still life here.You could live a whole new lifeand you could live itcompletely authenticallyand you could be healing during it.There's another big chapter for Gen Xand it doesn't have toexist in this one lanethat we've all been riding in,I guess, if that makes sense.Yeah, that's kind ofwhat I was chipping at.I maybe didn't nail itquite the way I meantwhat I was thinking in my brain,because I feel like we're a little uniquein the sense of whatyou're talking about is like,we come from a time when we didn't havethat kind of exposure.Yes.We were very siloed and isolated,not only in our homes, buteven in our world in general,just this isolation from the outside,everything else was going on in the world.And so now we're in thisspace where we never had that.And now you have thesedoorways into all these other worldsand it's insight andsort of these experiencesthat you're living through other peoplethat you're like, holy shit,like there's this wholeother world, this vast world,and there's all thecomplexities that come with itand all of the nuances and all that,oh, and oh, wait, I can heal?Like I didn't know that was possible.Wait, somebody's doing thatand I wanna know how they did that.And you start followingthem and you track their storyand you're like, and theyhelp you somehow, right?That is something that Ifeel like Gen X is latched onto.That's the kind of unique part.Millennials, they had a lotmore social media than we did.We didn't get it till wewere a little bit older.And so, and a lot of us bythen were starting our careersand having kids and we didn't have timeto digest in that way.And so now getting it,I feel like we'velatched onto that even more so,which is why you're seeingsuch this huge presence of Gen X.And I don't think it's because we're like,over, we're trying to learntechnology or social media.I think it's just that we're like,we're attracted to that.Attracted to theopportunity to experience the worldin a way that we never did.And I think boomers are,that's why you see so many boomers onsocial media as well.I think they too areexperiencing the world in a waythat they never had.They get glimpses and doorways to spacesthey've never been in.And into connectionand community with othersthat they would have neverhad the opportunity to have.And so this social mediahas really just given usthis incrediblepathway to people and insightand learning and healing.And I don't think people see it that way.Sometimes they just look at it and go,oh, it's social media.It's just dance trends and negative people,but there's so much more to it.There's a whole other world.There's a whole other world.And I think that'swhat they're attracted to.They probably don't realizethat that's what they'reattracted to, but that is.They're gaining experiencesin a way they never had before.And it's like, for me,it's almost at times,like I get these little classes about lifethat I would have never was.It just depends on whichperson happens in my feed that day.And some of them I like,some of them did, I don't.And I absorb what I wantand I scroll past the rest.So how does yourfourth business, Gen X Tour,that is where you aretaking it beyond social mediaand you're seeing everyone face to face.You're in real life, quote unquote.First of all, how did that start?So, one of the biggestquestions I always would getwas how can I see you?Like, are you on stage somewhere?How do I, I just wanna hug you.I get that a lot.And I'm like, you assumeI'm a hugger, but you know.(laughing)I just wanna hug you orthey just want to meet me.They just want, they wanna hang out with me.They wanna have a drink with me, whatever.And so I would hear thatso much that back in 2023,I decided to do a cruise, like just myself.Like me and a small group of people.I just like, if anybodywants to go on a cruise,like we should get together.And so we did.And it was one of themost incredible experiencesof my life.Five days with just hangingout with a bunch of Gen Xers,complete strangers I'd never met.And we had just an incredible timethat I walked away from that wanting more.Like I was like, I'm gonna do this again.And so, but I didn't wannabe the center of attention.That's a lot of responsibility.And I was on that cruise.And I thought I should reach out.I should do, like getsomebody else to do this with me.And at the time, before that cruise,I had reached out to KellyMann and I had reached outto her, I don't know,because she was one ofthe few Gen X creatorsI knew at the time to see ifshe wanted to do something.I asked her to come on the cruiseand she was like, I don't do water.So I was like, okay, maybewe should do something else.So we talked aboutdoing something in Nashvilleand it just never transpired.We didn't have the time toget it together, whatever.So anyway, fast forward.I was in Las Vegas last Aprilfor the Chair Choice Awards.And I met theprofessor Nick Harrison there,who I also love.And I was like, dude, I loved him.We just, we, we jot, we, youknow, we gelled right away.And I was like, weshould do something together.We should like collaborate somehow.And I was like, you shouldcome on a cruise with me.And so he was like, well, before a cruise,like we should likeget together or whatever.And I was like, yeah, so we got talking.And I was like, well, youknow, I talked to Kelly Mannolast year about doingsomething and she seemed interested.Let me reach out and seeif she's still interested.So she was interested.Then we pulled it in the dead bod veteran.And before you know it, we'relike, let's go to Nashville.And we thought, Kelly especially,thought we were just going to get togetherand hang out in our pajamas,eat bonbons and pizza weekend,you know, and have a good time.And we were all down for that.We were in the meantime,we might, we were like,we will go to a bar and we'lljust tell people in Nashvillethat we're at this barand they can come out,hang out with us if they want to.And I mean, there's between the four of us,we have like 25 million followers.So we're like, somebody'sgoing to be in Nashville.And so it didn't turn into that.Nick was just starting todo some improv at the time.And I think he had theitch and he was like,we should do a comedy show.He's the youngest of usall, by the way, born in 80,July, by the way.So I'm like, you're like,but says the trophy Gen X are here.Like you're barely, you barely made it bro.So he, anyway, he was like,we should do a comedy show.And me, Kelly, John, which is the dead,but none of us have everdone, never done stand up.I was like, I'm not doing that.I'm not a stand up comedian.I'm not doing it.He's like, I think you guys can do it.You can do it.Long story short, we dida comedy show in Nashvilleand we did two comedy shows in Nashvilleand an after party at Pince Mechanical,which is like this barcade thingand over like 550 people came.And so we were like, what the fuck?That was crazy.So we decided to do itagain in Cleveland, Ohioat a dueling piano bar, which was amazing.It was incredible.It was like the vibe ofthe music and the comedyand there we sold that show out.And anyway, what came outof that was we were like,we probably are going tohave to keep doing thisbecause people kept saying,when are you coming to my city?When are you coming to my city?And we had, I mean, we keptselling out show after show.And so just in June, June1st, we were in St. Louis,which is Kelly's home state, home city,and played the factory of 2100 people.And we sold it out.Wow.That's awesome.It was wild to be walkingthe stage with 2100 people.Oh my gosh.It was insane, insane.And now-The energy, that must be nuts.It was, the energywas, it was electrifying.It was, I can't even describe to you.It was just, and then, so it'snot just a comedy show anymore.So I think between the comedy showand the dueling piano bar and all that,it's kind of a little bitcomedy, a little variety show.And so we brought a millennial in now.He's our host, Justin Rupple,and he does over 300 voice impressions.And so he's ourresident punch you in the arm,little millennial we get to pick on.He's part of the show now.And we brought in a musician that is therethat helps us out with cues of music.And so it has turnedinto like a little bit moreof a movement.I mean, it's peoplecome, they get to laugh,they get to feel seen,they get to feel validated.And they're around a bunch of peoplethat have lived a verysimilar life to them.And they get a good dose of nostalgiaand they walk awayfeeling lighter and upliftedand this sense of belonging.And it's just a wild thing, man.Like at St. Louis,everybody lighten up their phones,like lighters in the audience.Like it was just this crazy experiencewhere I was like, what thefuck life am I living right now?Like this is insane.I would have never thoughtthat that would ever be somethingthat would come to lifepurely out of making videosabout my generation orany of us for that matter.We all make our ownversions of generational contentand combining the four of us togetherwas like "Wander Twins Activate."I can't even explain it.It was just like thiscrazy combination of powersthat just has been crazy andinsane and magical and amazing.And the first show wedid, it was what was wild.We've learned a lot.In Nashville, we had so many people come.The first, we went to Penn's Mechanicalfor like the after party.And we, all four of us got pinned downin four different cornersfor like the entire timewe were there, it waslike three and a half hourswith a line of people that was wrappedaround the fuckingbuilding just to come and meet us.We're like, what the fuck is this?And so Kelly was like,we're never doing that againbecause she's never left her house.She doesn't leave, she'slike, I don't leave my house.Okay, I don't fly, I don't travel,I don't leave myhouse, I don't go on water.Well, now we have pulled her so faroutside of her comfort zone.We had put her on planes,she's getting on a cruise,she's doing all kinds of well.And she was just like,that's never happening yet.So now we have a verycarved out meet and greet.We limit the number of people.We have like, they can come take a pictureand meet us or whatever.But I love meeting the people,like the people who come up to meand genuinely are like,you've changed my life.Like you saved my life,you've changed my life.Like you make my day every day.Like I don't, I takethat shit so seriously.And it's great to just likefeel that sense of community,in person, not through comments,like in to be gettingthese people's presence.We had a woman in New Orleans,we did New Orleans in February,that came from Indianawith her entire familyto the show in New Orleans.She was diagnosed with cancerand it was on her bucket list.She had to come and meet us all.And what?Like that, you can't put into perspectivethe impact you have onpeople until moments like that.You take for granted almostthose moments until it happens.What is that like though?What you're describing islike a rock star, right?It's movie star grade stuff, right?If someone saw, we saw,we're big fans of Billy Strings.We saw Billy Strings upin Pennsylvania last year.And I was just like, I went total fanboy,total jackass mode.And he was just like,what's that like to have,it's gotta be such a surreal thing.It's so surreal and itfeels like I'm in a dream.When people call me acelebrity, that feels weird.It almost, there'slike this repellent almostthat feels fake.I have imposter syndrome,so that is really difficultfor me to digest and process.But in the beginning it felt uncomfortable.I've gotten a little more used to it,but it's still, there arestill moments where I'm like,well, I told you in St.Louis, where you're like,I was like, what, wherethe fuck am I right now?Like how does this my life?How am I standing on astage with 2,100 peoplein the audience thatare all cheering for usand then come up to youafterwards and hug youand just want to love youand tell you how muchyou've changed their life.Or like I said, that, I mean,that wasn't the first cancer patient.There's been other people,but to have her come and say,this was, this is on my bucket list.I wanna do this before I die.We were like, what?Like that is really hard tolike process in your brainand connect with like,how, what did I say or doin my stupid little 30second or 60 second videosthat impacted your life in a waywhere you felt like you wanted to come hereand meet me before you die.Like that is wild.And that is really, yeah, it is powerful.And that's the partthat continues to fuel meof like, I don't, I'llnever take that for granted.I am very mindful of whatI put out into the worldbecause I recognize the impact it has.And the, I wish Icould answer the thousandsand thousands of messages that I getbecause I never wantanybody to feel like it fellon deaf ears that I didn't hear them.I didn't listen, but Ijust can't read them all.There's so many, so manypeople reach out to me through DMsand like, they just wanna thank me.They just wanna tell me their story.They just want to let me know that Isomehow impacted them.And that there are timesthat that's really overwhelmingwhere it's just like, it'shard because it is so powerful.It is so significant.It is so surreal that it feels like I'mon another planet somewhere.I have to pinch myselfsometimes, be like, yeah.Yeah, no, it's really cool.It's really cool.I'm very humble andgrounded and I will never feellike I make sure in those moments,like I'm like, remember who you are.Like I am not, I'm not a rock star.I'm not, I'm just me.I'm just normal everydayperson that never wantsto lose that groundingof like, I'm just human.I put my pants on just like you do.Where does this?Yeah, yeah.But that's why you connectso strongly with these peopleis you're authentic and you're realand what you shared came from inside of youand that's what's drawn them in.And so it's interesting tobe, in the midst of you beingyour most, in this season of your life,when you're being your most authentic self,even though it's a fluidthing and you're always workingon it, but you've created that foundationto also have impostersyndrome at the same time.You know, those two thingsdon't totally go together, right?It's kind of like you are being real.You are being your authentic self,but the accolades are so vast that I'm surethere's that feelingof I don't deserve all.This is like, where is this coming from?But it's simply becauseyou truly are representingauthenticity for a whole generation.And for our generation,as we talked about before,that's such a big deal.Yeah, it's a lot of weight to carry.Like the number of people that call me,like you're our Genexspokesperson, our Genex queen,you know, whatever, likethose are big labels for methat I'm like, I didn'tmean, I didn't set outto be a voice of ageneration, like I didn't.And I don't consider myselflike a voice of a generation.Like I said, I'm just me.But yes, impostersyndrome is really difficultto manage while I doshow up as my real self,but there's some voice inside of me.And I think it stillstems from childhood trauma.And you said something about like,I forget exactly how you said it,but basically likebeing your authentic self,but not essentially we werenever good enough growing up.You know what I mean?Like you were never allowed to be too bigfor your own riches.You were not allowed to be,you weren't allowed tobe confident out loud.Like they, we weren't celebrated.We would knock you down.I was expecting this girl.Yes.Well, yeah.Like you're not all that in a bag of shoes.You know what I mean?They made sure to let youknow they would tear you downintentionally to put you in your place.And so there's this voice in my headthat is still saying,you're not real enough.That's not real.You're a fake.Like these people thinkyou're this, you're not.Because that is in theresomewhere in that wiringthat is like, no, you're not good enough.You're never going to be good enough.And so the imposter syndromesteps in where it's like, nope.And that's an inherited belief system.You know, I didn't, Iinherited that from other people.And so, you know, generational,the generational inheritance that Gen Xgot from the boomers and the silent genis heavy shit.And one of them is just what I, you know,I think a lot of usstruggle with imposter syndrome.A lot of us struggle with,you know, am I good enough?And I try to put content outthere to tell people you are.You are good enoughexactly the way you are.But I still strugglesometimes to believe that myself.And I'm on that.Yeah.There will be someasshole that's ready to tell youthat you're not good enough.Oh, always.And that you don't deserve it.Always.It's there.That's just projection.But no, I think that Idon't need somebody to tell me.I could tell.I tell myself, I got that covered.Yeah.I think we're all, we're as a generation,most of us are pretty good at that.That's what we're fighting, right?Daily, because, you know,who do you think you are?And knocking us downwas kind of how it was.So they didn't want youto ever feel like you were,you were better than them or that you were,you were, you know, you were too good.Like I said, you wereeither too good or too big.Don't get too big.The one I remember, don'tget too big for your britches.Like don't celebrate yourself.Don't do that.If you felt good about somethingand you were trying to celebrate it,they would make sure to tell you in a waythat you felt bad for celebrating yourself.You felt bad for being whatever you wereor achieving whatever you achieved.And that's unfortunate for a lot of peoplebecause that was my experience.I know it was the same for a lot of others.And so I think you, especially again,that was in fundamental years of life,you know, where all that's forming,that becomes your internal belief system.And there's still this voice in my head,no matter how hard I tryto beat that shit out of me,it's still there.And it's a struggle.It's an everyday struggle.And I'm, like I said, I'm honest about itbecause I can sit here, youknow, and tell you one day,you're good enough.And I can believe that about myself today,but tomorrow I may notbelieve that, you know?Oh, I think it's a constant fight.Like we're always fighting our demons,especially those of us Gen X that hadtraumatic childhoods.Like those demons are there.I always say no matterhow much I work on myselfand I've healed and all that,I could be triggered like thatif the right situationpresents, I'm brought right back.And I'm aware I'm being brought back.And I know what's going on,but it's a fight, you know?And when I was younger, Iwould lose the battle a lot more.I rarely lose it.And in fact, if I lose itnow, it's shocking to me.I'm like, wow, that I forgot.But it also reminds me how far I've comebecause I'm like, wow, Ihaven't been in this space in years.And I used to be in this space every day.So it's also sometimes a reminder to meto be proud of myself andto see how far I've comeand how much I've won,I'm winning the battle.But there's always that threat.They're around the corner.They're never totally gone.So I feel that.Yeah, so the wholecelebrity thing, rock star thing,whatever, that imposter syndrome keepsme from embracing thatfeeling or that title,that people give me that label.That just feels weird.But the takeover itself, likeme being in close to the peopleis an incredible thing that I can't deny.I can't deny that.I can't deny the energy.I can't deny just thefeeling of, like I said, belonging,the camaraderie, the community.It reminds me a lot of when we were kidsand we ran together in bicycle packs,little motorcycle gangs.It's like that.The gangs all back together.We're hanging out for a night.And it's just a good time.And we got three shows coming up in August.So we're doingAtlantic City in August 22nd.So no, no, no, no, August 8th,August 22nd is a different day.I just looked at mycalendar and it says the 22nd.No, August 8th, we playAtlantic City at Caesars Palace.And then August 9th, we're inCincinnati at the Hard Rock.And then August 22nd,we're playing the ChevalierTheater in Medford, Massachusetts,which is a suburb outside of Boston.And then we've got showslined out for the year.It was September.I think we're inCharlestown, West Virginia,which is outside of DC.And then we go to Seattle.And then we go to HotSprings, Arkansas, which was not--I didn't know that was going to beour calendar, Hot Springs, Arkansas.And then we've got the cruise coming up.And we're going to do FortLauderdale before the cruise.And then we're alreadybooking shows for 2026.That's amazing.And all those ways you described it,it also brings, I think, comfort to people.It's a comfortable place.So it's a comfort.They leave their feelingprobably just like a hug almost.It is like a hug.Yeah.Yeah.I mean, they get a hug.How the hell are you managing all this?It's really hard.[INTERPOSING VOICES]It's not easy.I need an assistant.I really do.Now, we have the four of us for the tour.The wives help out.Krista's helped out.And Lisa, which is Nick's wife, Julie,which is John's wife,Bronnie, which is Kelly's boyfriend.He's our security detail now.Good boy.You know, we all have pulled together.And we also now-- we havesome people, booking manager,Reuben, and then Justin.We brought on the millennial.And so we've been-- it's been--we're learning.We don't know what the fuck we're doing.We literally have no idea how to do a tour.We're just piecing it together.But it helps for merunning businesses, having kids,doing this tour now, writing a book,still being a content creator.I couldn't do itwithout the support of Krista,because I mean, I just literally could not.She pulls a lot of weightfor me in a lot of ways.And I think the same goes for the others.Each of us have a reallyawesome support person,emotional support person, if you will,that are there for us, that help us.But it's not easy.There's a lot of ballsin the air all the timethat we're juggling.And I literally got off of our team meetingand jumped right on here,like literally 60 seconds.I got to go.I got a hard stop.I got to go.So we keep each other in check.We get to-- we meet, Zoom call.You know, we get together.We talk about all the moving parts.And we're just kind of--we're just taking it one day at a time.We're just whatever happens, happens.And we're like, if thetour continues, great.If it doesn't, I thinkit was an amazing thingwhile it lasted.And I think we all havereally bright futures.I think my biggest message for peopleis that you're never too late.Who would have thought all ofus in our frickin' 40s and 50swould be on stage for the first time--I mean, I did not this kind of stage,but for the first time,doing stand-up comedy,doing on a tour, justmeeting thousands of people.That was not on my bingo card.Markle.No, I mean, I was going toask you, what was it like--how did you-- because you saidyou've never done comedy before.So did you create your own set?Did you write?I write all my--I write all my own material, by the way.Everything I do.And so how was it that first timeyou walked on stage the very first timeto do your very first set?Frickin' wild.It was a very uncomfortable place for me.Because I really struggle--I told you guys I struggle with memory.And so I always have.And menopause has made iteven worse with brain fog.And so my biggest fear wasthat I was going to forgetwhat I was supposed to say.You write the shit, and then I'm like,if people only knew what ittakes for me to create a video,like, I have to really--I have to write all my shit out.And then I don't practice it per se,but I sometimes have torecord a video many times for meto get out what I want to say.And so having--writing out my bit for a stand up,I was so afraid of forgetting and freezingwhat I was supposed to saythat I just made a joke out of it.And I was like, I'm in the phase of lifewhere I have to havethese giant fucking cue cardsso I can remember what thefuck I'm supposed to say.And so I just wrote the shit out.I just write it out,kind of the topic, mainly.And I just carry them in my hand.I'm like, I'm not ashamed totell you guys that I have CRSand I can't remember shit.And so I need these papers.So I fucking rememberwhat I'm supposed to say,because I got a lot I want to say.And so I just use them as part of the bit,you know, that it's like,this is important to me,because I don't want toforget what I'm supposed to say.I don't want to disappoint people.I don't want to forgetwhat I'm supposed to say.I don't want to disappoint myself.And so maybe that's a trauma response.I don't know.But I'm still learning allthese things about myself.But it's been--I wrote it all out.And the first time Idid it was scary as shit.And then I had to do two shows.So our Nash show, we didtwo shows back to back.And so the second time itwas a little bit easier.But then the problem is thatwe were doing the old persontour, where we were like, we're onlygoing to do this likeonce every couple of months.And so that's what we were doing.We did Nashville.And then a couple monthslater, we did Cleveland.And then a couplemonths later, we did Atlanta.And then New Orleans.And they've been spread out.And so the problem is that when you onlydo it like once everymonth and a half, two months,it's like new every time.I'm like, I don't rememberwhat I'm supposed to say.I'm like, all of thisfeels new again, you know?Now this month, I'm hopingwith August doing three shows,I'm like, I might actually get it down.I might nail it.You know, when comediansdo multiple shows a weekand they do the same setevery night over and over,they just get to whereit's like boom, boom, boom.I'm not doing that.We're doing an old persontour where it's spread out.And I don't have any desireto play five nights a week.I don't want to do that.I have no desire to do that.So I'll just have tokeep using my cue cards.But it's been a wild ride.The Genex takeover is--it's like nostalgia meets a best friend.It's really hard to describe what it--That's amazing.No, it's wonderful.Incorporating the no carsinto your bits, brilliant.Yeah, a good thing I knew to do.I was like, I have to bring these on stage.Because Nick hit his little improv--I've been doing improv.We can all do comedy, whatever.I was like, Nick--he was the one I asked for.I was like, Nick, I don't know what the--I can't remember.He's like, oh, you just write little--I just carry a littlepiece of paper with me.Like a little piece of paper like this.And I was like, that isnot going to work for me.This is not going to work.So I actually was like, I'mjust going to have to make--so I thought index cards.And I was like, it's still not enough.I got these big pieces of card stock.And I write the shit out.And I take them out on the stage with me.And I'm just like--everybody else-- comedians,they keep their little pieceof paper because they're trying to hide,that they have any notes.I'm not hiding shit.Because I'm real anyway.I'm like, this is me.Take me or leave me.And if you don't like thecue cards, go fuck yourself.I don't know what to say.I love it.So in the midst of all this, you mentionedyou were at the Cheer Wars?Cheer Wars.So what are the Cheer Choice Awards?Cheer Choice Awards-- lastyear was the first year I went.A friend of mine, anotherGenX content creator, actually--I'd seen that he had beenin Vegas the year beforeat the Cheer Choice.And I reached out.I was like, what is this?He's like, it's a big charity event.He's like, it's one of the most amazingthings I've ever done.And you should come.And so I was like, OK.So I checked it out.And I told Krista about it.I was like, hey, Leonardsaid we should come to the CheerChoice Awards.And she was like,well, if we're going to go,is there an opportunity to be a sponsor?And I was like, probably.So I reached out to Leonard.He got us connected.Long story short, we endedup being a sponsor last yearat Cheer Choice Awards.And what it is is it is a charity thatgives to people in need.It's called-- the charity iscalled Spread the Cheer USA.And they put on-- the Cheer Choice Awardsis this essentially an award ceremony--Red Carpet Event Full Award Ceremony--for content creators tohonor content creators thatare putting and doinggood work in the world.And so they honor allkinds of different categoriesand motivational, inspirational cosplay--everything frommotivational, inspirational cosplay,and dancers, and animal advocates.So I went last year, and itwas one of the most incrediblethings I had had theopportunity to experience.And I was like, oh my god,we have to do that again.And so this year, mycompany was a sponsor-- again,Wholesome Hippie--and me, John, Nick, andKelly, all four of us.Because it's a People's Choice Award.So People nominate you.You're not nominated by them.It's a People's Award.And so we were allnominated for awards this year.And so I was up for three awards.I think John and Nick were each up for two,and Kelly was up for one.Well, so that was new.So my company is a sponsor,and I'm also up for these awards.And so the way itworks is you're nominated,and then there's a voting process,and you're voted by the people.It's not like-- so every week, itnarrows and narrows, andpeople keep casting their votes.And so you start off witha big, big pool of people,and then they narrow it to the top 10,and then they'll narrowit down to the top five.And so I got knocked out oftwo of my categories, which--again, this is impostersyndrome showing up in full force here.So I was nominated for Cheer of the Year,which is the biggest awardof the entire award ceremony--comedy novice, andmotivational inspirationalwith more than one million followers,or something like that.And so I was like--in my brain, I was like, OK,motivational inspirational,I'll take that.That makes sense.Comedy novice, that makes sense too.I'm doing comedy now, and I'm funny.I mean, I never thought I was funny,but apparently I'm funny.And Cheer of the Year, that one felt like--I was like, no, that doesn't feel--there's no way I belong in that category,and I'm not going to win.So I didn't really put alot of effort into any of it.People voted, and atthe end I got knocked outof two of the categories.So I got knocked out ofmotivational inspirational,gets narrowed down to the top five.I got knocked out of comedy novice.I'm still in top fivefor Cheer of the Year.And I'm like, this is not right.And people are like,what are you talking about?I'm like, this category is for peoplethat are making a realdifference in the world.People that are doingGod's work kind of shit,they're really out theredoing impactful things.I just make stupid, funnyvideos about my generation.Like, this is not right.Long story short, I won.Amazing.That's amazing.It was a wild experienceto hear them call my name.Because I was a presenter as well,I was presenting multiplecategories, I was in the back.I was backstage when theywere announcing my award.And so I didn't even knowthey were doing my award.I was backstage doing other shit.They called all of thepresenters to the back.And so I was in the back.And all of a sudden they're caught,they're like, will the realSlim Sherry please stand up?And they're calling me out on the stage.And I was like, what?I didn't even prepare aspeech because I was convincedI wasn't going to win.I was like, there's noway I'm winning that award.It's actually the one--I don't know if you seethe Heart Award back here,that Chair of the Year award.So that was wild andweird and felt crazy to me.I can't imagine.Did you have to give a speech?I did.I had to go out there andgive a fucking acceptance speech.I didn't even prepare one.I didn't know what--I was like, what I said, Ithink what came out of my mouthfirst was this doesn't feel right.If you were giving me anaward for the most swear wordsin the year, this would fit.This would make sense to me,but this doesn't make sense.But here I am.And so the fact that thatwas a people voted awardwas crazy to me.That I just really--I'm still, I think,processing that a little bit.I still am like, I can'tbelieve I won that award.It didn't feel like I should have.It just shows, though, theeffect you have on peoplein their regular life.The fact that you havebecome such a special personon the daily for people.And that's probably where that came from,because of the consistency you put inand the connection you've made.That's it right there.Yeah, I mean, especiallybecause during the voting process,you have to vote-- you vote every dayfor a certain period of time.And so you only get to vote once per day.That's it.You get one vote a day.And so the fact that that many peoplecontinue to show upfor me every day and votewas crazy.I was like, wow, that is so--I don't have words to describe it.It was just so out of body almost for me,the thought that somebodywould do that in my honor.You have a community.You've built a community.100%.I mean, if that littlegirl could see you now,have you ever taken a moment and justmentally thought of herand said, look at us?Look where we are?I have my moments.Yeah.The book is making-- givesme those moments quite a bit.There's a lot of reflection during the--when I sit and I write and I let myselfconnect with that little girl.Because I haven't most of my life.I have not--I've just kind of ignored her, I guess.And so now, when I sit and Iwrite, we visit a lot more.And so yeah, there's been a few momentslike that where it's likeall the things they told uswe couldn't be and all theways that they held us down.And look, that's why Isaid, you're never too late.You're never too old.And you're always enough.I say it because I mean that.I mean, I struggle at timesto believe that the last part.Because that is-- it's a process for meto unbecome all of thosethings that people gave me,that the inherited belief system that--so it takes a while.Maybe always.Healing is a journey.It's never-- it's never, never done.Healing happens forever.And so it's learning to--I believe it more now than I used to.So yeah, we sit sometimesand we talk, me and her.You're honoring herthrough everything you're doing.Because I get it.I ignored my little girl too.And then one day, I thought, you know what?I'm going to stick up for you.And you deserve to come along on this ride.And everyone ignored you.I certainly shouldn't be.I should be the last person ignoring you.So I'm going to nowrecognize you and honor you.And you're going to comewith me and have all the thingsthat you deserved.But you have to be in the right head spaceto finally let her join on the journey.Oh, I totally agree.It wasn't easy.And part of that, theignoring, we were taught that.We were taught to ignoreour own feelings, our own bodytrying to tell us.The body tells you it is an alarm system.And we ignore it.We ignore the pain.We ignore the sadness.We ignore our own needs.We sacrifice so much of ourselvesfor our children, for our families,for all the expectationsthat people have of us,the world at large.And we were taught to ignore that.And so when you finally are like, OK,I'm not going to ignore you anymore.The experience that comes with thatis almostindescribable, like this reuniting.It's reuniting with a part of yourselfthat you had left behindfor so long, for decades,almost like you buried her.I buried mine.To me, I was like, she's dead.That part of me is dead.And now it's like, oh, she's not.I've resurrected her.And we are getting toknow each other, whichis an experience in itself.Yeah, it's cool.So as far as the book,when did you start it?I actually startedwriting it about two years ago.Wow.And I stopped.I originally was writingit with my sister-in-law,a different book, actually.So if I'm really honest, the book I'mcurrently working on,I've only been working on for about a year.Maybe not even quite a year.But the original book I was writing,I was writing with my sister-in-law.She has a PhD in English literature.She's fucking smart as shit.She writes.And I was like, she knowsme better, almost as goodas anybody else.She can really capture my voice.And we started-- so she waswriting with me co-authoring.And then it just--with her job and my work andwhatever, it just got tabled.So I decided I was going to try on my ownto write a different book.And so this is more alittle bit memoir, self-help,motivational development.I don't even know whereit's going to sit just yet,but it's a little bit of all of that.And it's been-- I'vereally, the last probably threeto four months, beenputting a lot more into it,which is hard with thetour and everything elseI've got going on.So I've tabled it, but I've just recentlytried to get back into it.And it's like uncoveringberry shit from thousands of yearsago.It's crazy.But I'm really--I believe in it.I believe in the work I'm doing.And I think if I can figure out howto organize my thoughts in a better way,I think I'll get it done sooner.I'm also perfectionist,also another inherited thingthat I hate.It's a positive and anegative at the same time.So it can be verydebilitating because I overthink.And it's not good enough.It's not good enough.It's not good enough.Well, and you getsecond analysis paralysis.Yeah, I mean, it's not much to analyze.The story is what it is.But I will overanalyze how I wrote it.Yeah.I'll overanalyze the structure I put it in.I'll overanalyze the arc.I'll overanalyze all kinds ofdumb shit where I'm just like,god, if you would just fucking stopalready, it's exhausting.But it's a part of me.And so I'm writing it--I thought in the beginning Iwas writing it for my fans,that they want more--they want that longer form.They want to know my story.They want to know, howdid you get where you are?How did you get there?What is the map?Where's the blueprint?They want to follow those dots.I get that.And so I thought originally Iwas writing the book for them.But I've realized the deeper I go into it,and I'm really writing it for her.I'm sure that's exhausting.Thank god for therapy becauseI go and sit with my therapistsometimes.I'm like, holy shit,because we'll check in.I only have it once a week.We'll check in.And she'll be like,well, how's your week been?And I'll just be like, all thesediscoveries or whatever.Thank god I've gotsomebody to talk it through.But there's a lot of--it's trying to get throughthe extraction of all the shit,pulling all that out so thatyou can get to the good stuff.And so that is exhausting.And you can't force it.It's coming through you.It's literally coming through you.And also, there's onlyso long you can do itbecause you do getmentally and emotionally drained.Yeah, I do.I've recently, just in the last week or so,started working on it again.But I had taken a few monthsaway from it because I had to.Because it was so heavy for me.It's a heaviness that puts me in a spacethat I don't live in anymore.And it's also putting me in aspace that I've never lived in.I can't say never, but Ihaven't since I was a little girl.That's also putting myselfin that space, in that time,so that I can write about it is almost--I can't do it for a long time because ittraumatizes you all over again.Yes, exactly.Exactly.She wouldn't bring it up, but shewrote a book aboutexperience she had probablyin your teens.And to go back and write that book, Iremember she'd be like--I'm like, what's up?I think I finished a chapter.Or I just got something out on paper.It was just gas.Because you can go back to that place.And for it to be authentic,you have to almost relive it.And it is re-traumatizing.And one thing I learned is I neverforced it because I wanted itto be real and high quality.So if it took me forever,then it takes me forever.If it doesn't, it doesn't.But whatever it is, inorder for it to be real,I had to give myself breaksso I could come back recharged.That's what I have to do.We do it again.Same because I want to staytrue to the story while alsohonoring who I am today andhonoring who I was or the personwho died--1,000 tiny deaths, that part of myself.I want to honor all those parts.And to do that, I have to beable to step away and rechargeor reset, if you will, andbring myself back into you're notthere.You're not living in that space.And it has given me a lot ofrevelations for my EMDR therapy.It chronologically going through my life,especially as a child.It's pulled out things that Ididn't even really remember.And with EMDR, you can pick atarget memory or target memoriesto work through.And it's allowed me to pullsome things out where I'm like,that makes sense.I need to work on that.I need to focus onthat and work through thatbecause it's allowing me to--I've almost been trying towrite a roadmap or a blueprintfor other people.I'm also discovering themap myself at the same time,where I'm like, I can nowconnect the dots in a waythat I never really did.And I think EMDR has helped me with that.And I think that process has helpedme to be able to getback into writing the bookbecause it's let me tomove past some things,process those, where I'm ableto sit in them a little longerthan I used to.Or in the past, it wouldpull me back into a dark place.And I've learned to takebreaks so I don't end upin a dark place.I can't imagine the tangency would go on.You get this discovery andyou're like, oh, you go here.Then you go here and you go all over.It's like a spider web.It is.That's actually a book.I talk about the spiderweb, kind of how it is--how you take this tinylittle dot and then all these--there's just this expansion.And when you startconnecting things together,you have these revelationswhere you're like, oh my god,now I can see why.You react this way or whyI am this way or that way.And it has been a revelation for me.Almost every time I sit down to write,there's a new revelation, anew something I crack openwhere I'm like, holy shit.And so I think you have--what I hope to share withpeople more than anythingis that you can get there.You just have to be ready.You have to be ready to receive that.And I think for most ofmy life, I really wasn't.I was very closed off.Like I said, I had a barrier to therapy.So although my mothermoving here was challenging,has been challenging for me, I thinkit pushed me into placesI wouldn't have gone maybeotherwise.Now, you're still on avery big healing journeywith everything you're doing.I have been on for a long time.But yeah, I'm a little morean accelerated experience of itnow than I was.Yeah.So if you could give theyounger generations meaningthey're just getting out of college--they're at that age, that early 20s age.Early 20s, mid 20s, late 20s.And they're feeling-- they're struggling.They're adulting for the first time.They are dealing with social mediaand comparing their lives to everyone elseand feel kind of lost assometimes for a lot of people,the 20s can throw you off.What advice would you giveto the younger generations?Well, number one, stopcomparing yourself to everybody else.Because I talked about this earlierthat a lot of it's not real.So you're comparing yourself, especiallythrough social media, to somethingthat is unattainable andinauthentic and not real.So number one is always be true to you.I wish I'd have known thatso much sooner in my lifeof just be you.Don't fake it for people.Just be who you are.But more importantly is thatyou don't have to have it allfigured out yet.There's no such thing as grown ups.We're all winging theshit our entire lives.We fake it really well, but we are not--none of us know what we're doing.So you don't have tohave it all figured out.And so that idea that somebody sells youthat you have to have yourshit together by the time you're30 or something, that's bullshit.It's a lie.And the world is full of so many lies.So don't believe them all.And that is a big one, is that it'sOK to not have it all figured outand to just take life as it comes,experience it, embraceit, enjoy it, and fuckeverybody's expectations.Stop worrying about whatthe world expects of youand just do what makes you happy.Because when you do what makes you happy,it'll never feel like work, number one.Work won't feel like work.It'll just be something youenjoy doing, and it brings youjoy.And my last piece of advice to themis to not work--not live to work, but work to live.Because I spent my entirelife doing the opposite, whichwas living to work, and Imiss so much of my life.And so that's my other big--that was my big driverfor when I quit my job,is I just was tired ofchasing something thatdidn't bring me joy.I wanted to--actually, I listened to aleader in the company at the time.It's his fault I quit joking.Listening to him speak tothe group, a big giant groupof leaders, because I was inleadership at the time too.And he was the one thattalked about his family.He was of island descent.And in his world, hisupbringing, his family,they worked so they could live.And they don't live to work.They take time off.They relax.They enjoy life.They focus on their bodies and making surethat they're taking time whenneeded to heal and all this.And he was telling this whole story.And here, this guy is standing up there.He's one of the biggestleaders in the organization.And he was talking about howhe, with chasing his careerand climbing the ladder,how he had lost that senseand was now more living to work.And it was something that he said to meabout that whole workso you can live.And I was like, I want that.I've never known that.I've worked my entire lifeand have continued to chaseand try to climb theladder and chase the next--like, I'd get the promotion.And then it was never enough.Well, what about thenext one and the next one?And you chase all of this.And for what?I was miserable, unhappy.I wasn't enjoying my life.I couldn't enjoy the raise or whatever.I was never there to enjoy it.I was just chasing the next promotion,the next expectation.And when I stopped doing thatand I started living in a waywhere I could enjoy my life,I just worked so I can live.I worked so I can pay my bills and Ican spend time with my family.And we can do things that are enjoyable.And whatever that looks like for you,it's different for everybody, whateverliving looks like to you.But stop living to work.And just take the--I think our youngerpeople are better at this.I really do.They're driving a culture oftaking time off when they needit.I didn't take any time.And life is short.Life is very short.It's the blink of an eye.And so live it while you can.And I know that was a lot of advice,but these are so many things I wishsomebody would have toldme.But the biggest one is, like I said,you don't have to have it all figured out.And stop letting otherpeople dump their shit on youof what they expect you tohave figured out by the time youget to be a certain age.I'm 52 and I stilldon't have it figured out.And I probably never will.So there's no such thing as adults.And so you can be--there's no such thing as grownups.There's adults.I mean, I'm not theadultiest one in the room,but I am an adult. But not a grownup.I'm still very muchtrying to figure out life.And so it's OK.It's OK to take your time.Yeah, that's so true.None of us-- thebiggest joke is that anyonehas it all figured out.None of us do.We're all learning.We're all figuring it out.Some of us just fake it better than others.Like, if everybody thinksthe Boomers had the shit--we thought our parents had it figured out.But the more I've gonethrough this process of uncoveringand discovery and whatever, I'm like,you know what I've discovered?Because they didn'thave it figured out either.They really didn't.What I figured out in mid-lifewas that my parents at that agewere-- they were justtrying to figure it out too.They didn't know what they were doing.Did they do it all right?No.Did they make mistakes?Yes.But do I think they were trying?I think they were trying with the bestthat they had at the time.And so they didn't have it figured out.They just faked it reallywell because they were told to.They were told to hideit, not talk about it,and put on the facade andthe mask and all the shitthey gave us.We inherited all that.But now I'm like, no.You know what?I want to tell youngerpeople, fuck that mask.That mask is really heavy.It's heavy.Yeah.I know it.And we're doing it.We're talking about the things.And we're sharing that advice.And we're talking about the hard topicsso that they don't have tomask, that they can startliving authentically way earlier.That's why I said, you don'thave to have it all figured out.Do you know?No.Not at all.You probably still won't haveit figured out when you're 40.And you might not haveit figured out when you--anybody who tells you,I've got it all figured out.They're a fucking liar.Yeah.Yeah.It's so true.It's so true.Now before I ask my last question,do you have any more questions?I don't.I don't.I think you've lived a remarkable life.It's awesome.Oh, yes.Absolutely.Really super--I'm motivated.I'm intrigued.You got me thinking.It's just such a cool conversation.I love that.I'm glad.Thank you for that.Congratulations on all your success.And it's just really cool.You didn't come fromthe greatest beginning,but where you're at now is somethingyou can be so proud of.And it's just cool.Thank you.Yeah.I think that would be myother last piece of advicebefore you ask your last question is,you can be whatever you want to be.You really can.And you can--I didn't set out--I never would havethought I'd be a comedian.It wasn't on my bingo card, but here I am.I still struggle to call myself a comedian,and I didn't plan it.At 52, I'm a comedian.I'm on tour.I just want an award Idon't think I deserve.There's just so many things that youcan be whatever you want to be.It's what you put into it.You get out what you put in.And if you do it with the right intention,anything is possible.100%.And I think Gen X is redefining aging.And we're continuing tolive and tackle our dreams.And hopefully, that's a great examplefor the youngergenerations, that once you get to 50,that's not the end ofanything, or 60, or 70,that you can continue to reinvent yourself.You can continue to grow, continue to heal,and continue to thrive.And I'm hoping that isone of the things thatwill end up being our legacyfor the younger generation.I hope that people lookback at our generation.And really, when they dissect it,see this group of people whohad this significant amountof trauma--we didn't call it thatthen-- but this significant amountof trauma that they had to figure out,pretty much on their own,how to unpack and heal from.And then in their second half of life,they start discovering and creatingthis amazing world around them.And I think that our legacy will be justthat of looking back and go, look at this--what you just said to me.Look at this incredible journey of,I didn't come from anything.I didn't go to college.I didn't even graduate high school.I had a kid at 17.I struggled a lot of years.And to land here where I'mat, I could look back and go,that was all by accident.It wasn't.It was all through intention.And finally, somehow,unlocking some door that alwaysfelt like a mystery to me, itfelt like I wasn't allowed to--I knew there wassomething on the other side,but I didn't know how to get there.And so I hope thatpeople do look back and go,look at all that theypersevered, all that they overcame,a lot of us, not all of us, thegenerational inheritancethat we were willing to trash.Say, fuck that.We're not going to do that.And hopefully, what comes of thatis that the future ends up being a lotbrighter than the last 50years or so that we have seen.I'm hoping that our youngpeople will pick up where we left offand will just make a better world.There's still a lot of shit we got to undo.And unfortunately, in a lot of ways,our generation is in the way in some ways.We are in the way.Not all of us, but some of us are.And until we-- just like we'dlike to talk about the boomerswon't retire and theywon't get out of the way,there's some of us that won't either.And so we need to move aside and let theseyoung people flourishand let them build the world they want.We are never going tohave the world we wanted.That is the truth wehave to have with ourselves.The world they promised usdoes not exist, and it never will.I don't think it ever did.It didn't.But it was a fake facade story.They sold us.And now we know that's never happening.So we have to embrace where we are.But that doesn't mean that there can'tbe a better future for thepeople that are going to come out.That's our job, is toleave this place betterthan it was for us.And that's what I hope isthat we will get out of the way.I think that's possible.I think it's true.And I think the first stepin that is acknowledgment.And the first step of acknowledgmentis probably callingbullshit on most things.Got to recognize thatit's kind of fucked up,and we should try to do what wecan to make it a little better.Yeah.And then show other peoplethat the next generation cancarry it a little further.Well, to your point, as faras the younger generationsand getting out of the way,being open to listen to them,listen to their ideas, listento what they want to create,listen to what they bring to us.Because I think somany Gen Xers and Boomers,when there's the new ideasthat millennials and Gen Z bring,a lot of Gen Xers andBoomers will be like, no, no, no.That's not how we do it.We do it this way, andthat's the way it's done.So getting out of the way,part of that is listeningand giving them a chanceto let's try it their way.Let's see what they have.And not doing what was doneto us, which is scold themand make them feel small andstupid in the process, whichis a lot of times what ends up happening.And so I do think we're in the way.I think back to you whenyou said the calling bullshitis that that's exactly what we need to do.We have to callbullshit on our own generation.And that's the thing, is thatthere are Gen Xers out therethat, like you just said,that's not how we do it.They're still holding on to the old way.They don't like change.They don't want to see change.Maybe they like the way things are.They're also very apathetic.It's comfortable.It's comfortable.They're apathetic.They don't care.And so those people to get out of the way,the people that don't give a fuck,they're like, fuck everybody.Fuck everybody else.But the problem is, is in doing that,you're fucking everybody.It's like, fuck it.I'm fine.That's how they are.My world is great.So fuck yours.And it's like, it's theproblem with some of youis that you are in the way.And it's the attitude.And so unfortunately, thatis something that is a plague.I don't talk about it, but I see it.It is a little bit of aplague for our generationand the boomer generationthat do have that attitude.That's where the boomer lights are,the ones that are very muchstill have that sort of boomerattitude.And it's like, you guys gotto get out of your own way.Just get out of your own wayand let these young people buildthe world that they want.We didn't do it.We're not too late.We can contribute.But we're not going to buildthe world that was promised.It's not coming.So we have to make something new.And to do that, we haveto get out of their way,is what I think.Well, and I think thecombination of those of uswho are trying to break thecycle with the way we raiseour own children, and then combinedwith talking aboutthings and not being shushed,because we were shushed for so long.We're like, we're not goingto shush about this anymore.We're going to talk about all these things.Hopefully the combination, we will at leastbe part of a cultural shift here.At least half of us,the other half maybe not,but maybe half of uscan represent somethingfor when people look back,they can say some of us did try.Yeah.I don't see it in my lifetime.I really do.I hope-- I look at myyoung people, my 11-year-old,and my 14-year-old, and I think about whattheir future looks like.And I hope to see it in my lifetime,like a truly just better world than--you look at ourgeneration, look at all the shit.If we really dissect all the shitthat we have livedthrough and all the promises,empty promises, it's like,how much more can we take?I just don't even know.It just feels so--then it just doesn't seemto be lightening up at all.It just seems to begetting wilder and crazier.We're just better attuning it out, I think.We are.But if you--I think we're almost numb to it.It's almost like a numbness to it.It's like, oh, yeah,that's just more of the same.That's the apathy thatwe have to recognize,that we're so used toliving in that kind of worldthat it's like we're apathetic to it.And we need to not be apathetic.We need to actuallyacknowledge it and do something about it.And one of those ways isgetting out of the way.And secondly, is itpurely just what I just said,which is acknowledging?Yeah, no, it's true.But you think about a lot of that, I think,is a trauma response,because we come from trauma.And then think about it.We saw the Challengerexplode when we were in school.We were right there for 9-11.All the things, a lot of generations--all of it.There's generations that can say,well, I was there for that thing.Hiding under your fucking desk.For all the things.I mean, the Boomers were, too.But not to--I mean, I hate to say--the truth is, a lot of thatwas their fault. A lotof it was their fault.But the Boomers, they wentthrough a lot of shit, too.And they called it the rightsmovement and the women's rightsmovement.And they've been through a lot of shit.And that's why they'reeven worse than we are.Because their apathy to allof that they have been through,all that they have seen,all that they have fought for,and to be so apatheticat this point in lifeand not willing to get out of the wayand not willing toacknowledge that we need change,is really a problem.Because some of them, some of the Boomersare only in their 60s.Well, they've given up, I think.I think that is a difference.A lot of them have given up.Not all.I don't want it being too broad of a brush.But a lot of them havegiven up, to your point,are very apathetic.They're like, fuck it.World's not going to change.I'm good.I think we're kind of in that zone of,I don't think we'rewilling to give up and be totallyapathetic.I think we're trying to do--move things forward a little bit.But in 10 years, maybe we will.I don't know.I don't know.The older we get, the harder it gets.I'm not going to lie.I know.But that's why we just allhave to keep living and thrivingand staying plugged in.I think that's where honesty comes in,being honest with me.I think we have to behonest with each other.Absolutely, 100%.Have you guys seen that memein the last day or so of the--I think it was the Challenger, right?The Challenger blew up.And we all watched it in school.And it was like, oh, rememberwhen the Challenger blew up?We were all watching it in our classroom.And then all of our teacherssaid, OK, everybody, go back.Go to math.Go back to math.Yeah.Yeah, that's perfect.There's a lot of jokes about it.It's true.Yeah.Because that's how they dealt with it.It was like, well, that happened.Back to class.You know, nobody talked about it.We're not going to talk about it.No one talked about it.OK, my last question is always, wheredo you see yourself in five years?I mean, I think I've prettymuch talked about all of that.Like, I see myself with a published book.I see myself doing keynote speaking.I'd like to be on stageempowering and inspiringgroups of people, not in a comedy way,but in a way like this,just truly inspiring peopleto live a better, moreauthentic life in how you get there.I see myself doing that.I see myself retiring from my other jobs.Like, I do.I see myself retire.I give myself till I'm 60.I said I'll be retired by the time I'm 60,but I'm not retired fromthat, like the other stuff.Like, I mean, I stillsee myself making content.There's so many things I could be doing,but I'm retired fromthe stuff that, you know,gets in the way of mebeing able to do bigger things,like what I'm doing withthe tour and with book writingand stuff like that.So yeah, I see myselfdoing even bigger thingsthan I'm doing now.Well, I could see you at a TED Talks.That's where I see myself there.Yeah.Get the book published, andthen maybe I'll get there.But yeah, I do.I see myself doing--you know, when I look back at my career,I loved being aninvestigator, but I used to train peoplehow to do what I did.Like, I would train the newup-and-coming investigators.I really loved that.I loved-- I find that I got alot of reward and fulfillmentfrom teaching other peopleand inspiring other people.And so it's not odd to me thatI'm finding my way back to that,because I did always fill my cup.And so I just see myself wanting to--I just want to help people.You know, I don't know what drivesme to want to help people other than Ispent so long in a placethat was just--I was miserable.And to be able to helppeople find a way out of that,I think, is what drives me.Because I know what itfeels like, and it sucks.You know, I've seencomments of people who are like,I'll never have that.I'll never be happy.That makes me so sad for them, you know,that they'll neverknow what that feels like.That's unfortunate.Well, what you're--I see all that happening.And when you are doing that,it will be cross-generational.I think that won't be just a Gen X thing.I think when you are out there helpingpeople and your book,that's a cross-generational movement.Not that it's not for Gen X, too.But that will be part ofhelping younger generations,because they struggle with trauma.They struggle with mental health.They struggle-- they need--they probably need advice sometimesmore than our generation.So I think that'll bean exciting thing for youto take how you help people and you--on the daily, you're helping people.But to take it on an even larger scale,and it will be peopleof all different ages.Yeah, no, I see that.I for all--I think the other thingthat's going to help us get there,and I love that you guys are doing this.Chris and I are actuallytalking about doing a podcast.Oh, nice.So we have an interesting dynamic.We both come from verydifferent walks of life.And we both are entrepreneurs.We're married.We have kids.She's in perimenopause.I'm in menopause.She was a teacher.She went to college.I was an investigator.We just had this really crazy--we just touch on a lot of different topics.And we got talking, and we're like,maybe we should dosomething where the two of us--we both have thisdesire to really help women,empower women, especially in midlife.In fact, I quit my jobwhen I was 43 with no plan,entrepreneurial spirit and all that.You can, again, going backto that, you can do anything.It's just maybe you need somebodyto give you some wisdomor guidance or experiencethat I'm willing to share,that I want to share with people.And Krista wants to share.And so we're like, we actually talkedabout doing maybe a podcast.That might be somethingon the horizon for us.Like, I got time.Yeah, definitely.I'm coming from--but her and I could just sit,and we can talk about anything.And so we thought about it.It's a great way for you to--what you're offering on social media,it's a great way for you tooffer it long form to people.Yeah, it's just the--when I talked about it, Iwas like, it's the edit.It's the editing.And I don't care about theequipment and all that shitin the setup, becauseI've got a studio here.I've got this room, andit goes way beyond this.And we've got a place for room for--because we've been going live--we've been live streaming for our businessfor almost 10 years.But we're used to talkingto a live audience, actually.And so we talked about it.I was like, studio and equipment,I'm not worried about that.It's more like the editand the timing and all that.And I was like, that, Idon't have the capacity for that.But there's ways around that, I guess.The editing is a lot, but you can do it.You can hire that out, though, right?You can.You can farm that out, for sure.You can definitely hire that out, for sure.Do you like editing your own?Yes.Yeah, but Brian's in IT.If he wasn't, we couldn't dothis, or we would hire it out.Because that is a huge help,is that he knows all the insand outs and can handle that.We're trying to get some underage laborwith our youngest.We can tell him thiswill help you with getting--he's 15.He's like, I don't care.They don't care about anything in that age.No.They don't care about what they--Yeah.What they care.Yeah.Yeah.Absolutely where he is.For that moment.Yeah.Well, I mean, Sherry, I can'tthank you enough for coming onand spending this time with us.Oh, we've loved it.That's very cool.And I know our listeners, this isgoing to be such a greatepisode for so many peopleon so many different levels.And I know it's going to help people.I know it's going to helppeople feel seen, understood.It's going to inspire.So again, thank you forsharing all of your story with us.Not all of it.It's really just aglimpse, even though we'vebeen talking for a while.I know there's so much more.But also, I know people callyou Gen X Queen and the Gen Xrepresentative.And I know that's a lot.But you definitely are on the forefrontof a movement for our generation.And I know it's a heavy weight, but youwear your crown beautifully.Thank you.And with a lot of grace, honestly.Just congratulations on everything,especially like Brian said, consideringwhat you went through to get there.And then the word keeps coming in my headas you've been talking is just courage.I just feel like howcourageous, all the steps you've taken,all the moves, all the leapsof faith, it's so courageous.And that just came from inside of you.No one gave you that.And so I think you're such a great examplefor other Gen Xers.Have courage and do it.There's no reason you shouldn't.Everyone, just go for it.We get our own way.Yes.And you're such a great example of that.So we can't thank you enough for coming on.Thank you guys for having me.I have thoroughly enjoyed this.And you guys are amazing.I really love--I know I said it earlier, but I don'tknow if it got into this part of the show.I love what you're doing.Keep doing what you're doing.It's people-- we need morevoices in the social mediaworld and just in the world ingeneral that are chipping away.Like I said, little bylittle at our generational trauma,at our nuances, littlequirky parts of us, all that.Just call it, like Isaid, calling us on our shit.We need more of that in the world.We need more honesty and transparency and--I told you, life goes--it goes by so fast.It's like a blink of an eye.And we're all coming intothat space, that age of like,life is going to speedup a whole lot faster.And trying to just get--touch people in a way that allowsthem to live more presently.I think you guys are touching on that.Maybe not in the way that wedid here today holistically,but you are.You are giving people reasonto pause and to think and toreflect, and we needmore of that in the world.So thank you for what youguys are doing and allowingme to be a part of this.No, we--That's awesome.Thank you.I mean, it means so much coming from you,and we appreciate it.And again, we're just sohappy that you shared your timewith us.We know you're very busywith all the things, so--And speaking of all--I was looking forward to this one.Cool.We were too, actually.Absolutely.Before our listeners, just a reminder,Sherry's boutique is called Feather & Vine,and also check out Wholesome Hippie.Now, is Wholesome Hippie--is that its own website, oris that through Feather& Vine?No, wholesomehippie.com, H-I-P-P-Y, hippie.Wholesomehippie.com to get--if you look into allnatural wellness or beauty,wholesomehippie.com,it is its own brand now.It's actually the stuffthat you see behind me there.That's cool.That looks great.All the links will be in our YouTube video.If you listen on Apple or Spotify,all the links will be on there.So definitely go support Sherry.We'll put all the links in the description,and also check out Sherry on social mediaas the real Slim Sherry.I love that.And then definitely go on GenxTour.com.They have nine more dates left, right?GenxTakeOver.com.GenxTakeOver.com.Sorry, GenxTakeOver.com.And we will make sure thatthat link is in there, too,because they have a lot moreshows the rest of the year.So everything for all of our listeners,everything related to Sherry, all the linkswill be in the description.But if you have any questionsor comments, please leave them.If you have anyquestions or comments for Sherry,we will make sure and let her know.Please let me know whenthis is going to air, too,because I would love to give a shout out.I'll share it on my socials.I want more people to know who you are,because I think that you guys add value.I don't really share a lot, but whenI see somebody adding value, I'll happilyshare that with others.And so I want other peopleto know that you guys exist.You're doing good in the world.That's awesome.Thank you so, so much.Thank you.And thank you to our listeners.Again, we love to hear from you.And we know you've lovedthis episode as much as we have.So we will see you next time.Bye.Bye.[MUSIC PLAYING]