<b>(Music)</b><b>Welcome to Genex adulting. And today we have Mary</b><b>with us. Welcome. Thank you. We're so happy to</b><b>have you here. I'm happy to be here. Thank you</b><b>for having me. Of course. So the first question</b><b>we always ask is what year were</b><b>you born? 1974. So you are Genex.</b><b>A proud Genex. And where were you born? Marlton,</b><b>New Jersey. So you're Jersey girl. I'm a Jersey</b><b>girl. Okay. And do you have siblings? Oh yeah.</b><b>Um, there's six of us. So I have five siblings.</b><b>Yeah. Okay. And what order</b><b>are you six? You're the baby.</b><b>Oh my gosh. So what's the range between your</b><b>oldest sibling and you nine years? Wow. Okay.</b><b>Yeah. So in nine years, yeah, that's that's, I</b><b>thought it was going to be more. Yeah. So in nine</b><b>years, your parents had six kids. Correct. Wow.</b><b>God bless your mom. Yes. Wow. And what's the mix?</b><b>Five girls and one boy. Okay. All right. So</b><b>that's a busy household. Very busy. And the town</b><b>you're, you, did you grow up in that town? The</b><b>one you're born in? I was born in Marlton, but I</b><b>grew up in a town called Morristown. Okay. New</b><b>Jersey. Uh, everybody thinks it's the one near</b><b>New York, but it's not as M O O R S. More's town.</b><b>Oh, I was. Okay. A Philly. Okay. Yeah. I was</b><b>about to say I grew up in Sparta, which is near</b><b>the Morris town. Yes. I think you've always</b><b>thought Mary grew up in that one. Morris town.</b><b>No, I thought, I thought you grew up in like</b><b>central New Jersey, but you, sounds like if</b><b>you're down in Philly, that's a little more</b><b>south. We call it South Jersey. Yeah. South</b><b>Jersey. So were you by the shore? Well, everybody</b><b>is kind of, it's like, we were 50 minutes to the,</b><b>to the shore. Okay. Even with traffic. Yeah.</b><b>Okay. All right. There's always traffic and</b><b>everything's an hour. Yeah. Yeah. That's true.</b><b>So, um, is it a small town? Yeah. It's a small</b><b>town. So you grew up in like a small town vibe.</b><b>It was, yeah, I did for sure. It was like just a</b><b>typical suburbia, good, really good schools.</b><b>Everybody went to the public school. Yeah. Um,</b><b>uh, used a little bit of farmland and a lot of</b><b>people, uh, worked in Philly, made some of the</b><b>Philly athletes live in Morris town because you</b><b>know, it's kind of right outside of the city.</b><b>Yeah. Yeah. Very suburbia. Now was your mom home</b><b>with you guys? She was. Yeah. Okay. So that's,</b><b>that's nice. So would you say you had the typical</b><b>Gen X childhood of you could leave and wander and</b><b>just as long as you were home when the lights</b><b>came on or were your parents maybe a little more</b><b>strict than a lot of the other boomer or silent</b><b>generation parents that Gen Xers had? Hmm. I</b><b>think, well, definitely I grew up in a strict</b><b>household for sure. Sure. Sure. I felt like that,</b><b>especially as the youngest. Um, but my parents</b><b>were definitely strict, but I do remember just,</b><b>you know, being outside and really the only role</b><b>is like, don't scream bloody murder, or I think</b><b>you're like dying and pretty much you can just be</b><b>out running around. Okay. There was no of stay on</b><b>the sidewalk by, you know, that was, yeah, I was</b><b>kind of it. So you could kind of wander wherever.</b><b>Kind of wander wherever pretty much. I remember,</b><b>um, we all were on a swim team. We all rode our</b><b>bikes there and back and it was like, I don't</b><b>know, five miles away across busy roads. Okay.</b><b>Yeah. I hit one time. I had a broken ankle on</b><b>time. I still rode my bike. Your sister got hit.</b><b>Yeah. Oh my God. Five miles. Could you imagine</b><b>letting our kids know, no, no, no, no, no, no,</b><b>no, no. There were no helmets. No, even in</b><b>Jersey, which I think is one of the states that</b><b>regulates everything at that time, there were no</b><b>helmets. No, yeah. Not that I recall for</b><b>anywhere. We never wore helmets. Not until you</b><b>got like a moped because mopeds were a thing</b><b>today. It's the surrounds the e-bikes. Yeah. We</b><b>had mopeds as kids. You had to wear a helmet.</b><b>Yeah. But not bicycles. Yeah. So you went to</b><b>elementary school there. You went to, did you</b><b>call junior high or middle school? Middle school.</b><b>Okay. Five through eight. Okay. All right. You</b><b>and we were junior high. Is that interesting? And</b><b>then high school there. Yes. So were you, did you</b><b>always have a sibling in school with you? Pretty</b><b>much. I mean, my sister above me, actually I</b><b>think she and I were the furthest as far as like</b><b>the order, she was two years ahead of me in</b><b>school, two and a half years ahead of me in age,</b><b>I guess. So yeah, I only didn't have her when I</b><b>got a little older at the end the last two years</b><b>that I always, and actually I also went to</b><b>college where one of my sisters went and she went</b><b>to college. We went to Loyola in Baltimore and</b><b>four of us out of the six went there. Wow. Yeah.</b><b>Well, we had rules. We had rules. It had to be a</b><b>Catholic college within a three hour driving</b><b>radius of horse town. So, okay. Okay. So did you</b><b>go to Catholic school? No. So I went to the</b><b>public school. All right. But then the rule was</b><b>you have to go to a Catholic college. Okay.</b><b>Except if you're the boy, then</b><b>you can go to NYU apparently.</b><b>Interesting. Yeah, that's hilarious. And so</b><b>that's just was a double standard that was</b><b>accepted in your house and I said something. I</b><b>was like, wait a second.</b><b>But, um, were you the only one that questioned</b><b>it? I think so. I mean, everyone's just like, Oh,</b><b>NYU cool. You know, and he played basketball. It</b><b>was cool. But I'm like, that is not a Catholic</b><b>university. No. Did you have like seven? I'm</b><b>trying to do the math. Your family was eight</b><b>people, right? Did you have seven parents being</b><b>the youngest? No, I mean, it's funny. No, they</b><b>didn't. They would, they were just, they were</b><b>like, it's funny because we broke my parents down</b><b>by the end, you know, I'm kind of getting older,</b><b>six kids. Or they're like, well, Mary, how did</b><b>you even let me do that? Like at one point my</b><b>parents just went to the store house and I was</b><b>like, by myself in the house, my sister's mind</b><b>was like blown, you know, she would go out.</b><b>They'd be like, be back by 10. You know, and they</b><b>weren't even around my last two years of high</b><b>school. I think that happens. That's happened</b><b>with our youngest. So as I know, we know where</b><b>Dylan is right now. We think we know we have a</b><b>general idea where he is. Actually, you told me</b><b>where everybody was except for Dylan. Yeah. And I</b><b>think you're the one that is watching him. He's</b><b>fishing, but we're not sure exactly where, but</b><b>somewhere in our town. Um, okay. So did you find</b><b>that comforting having a sibling in school with</b><b>you or was it at times annoying because you</b><b>always had someone there that kind of was</b><b>watching or that kind of kept an eye on you and</b><b>you couldn't have complete freedom, I guess, to</b><b>be you. She really didn't keep an eye on me. Like</b><b>everybody just kind of did their own thing. And</b><b>in fact, it was good. The sister I had above me</b><b>because she was, um, a good student, she got good</b><b>grades. So she kind of greased the wheels for me</b><b>when I came in, they were like, oh, please</b><b>didn't, you know, until, but it was good in the</b><b>beginning. Okay. Okay. So that was, that didn't</b><b>like squash any of your freedoms or self</b><b>expression or anything. So how would you describe</b><b>what kind of student you were? Hmm.</b><b>I was not a good student. Now, what was the</b><b>reason for that? Do we just, um, not challenged</b><b>or do you think like you might've had, um, like,</b><b>I know there's a lot of, um, Gen X women that</b><b>have, they found out they have undiagnosed ADHD</b><b>or do you think you just were not interested in</b><b>school? It just wasn't a thing. I was just super</b><b>bored and I just wanted to talk to my friends and</b><b>be outside and play sports and I just, it was</b><b>boring. Yeah. So not challenged is what it sounds</b><b>like. They didn't grab you. I mean, I mean, I</b><b>guess it wasn't, I could have been challenged. It</b><b>was challenging to skate by was just good enough</b><b>grades. That was kind of my goal. Okay. So I</b><b>could have time to do the things that I wanted to</b><b>do. Which sounds like sports. Yeah. So were you</b><b>athletic right from the start? Yes. Yeah. When</b><b>did you start playing sports? I joined the swim</b><b>team when I was three. Wow. Is that when you</b><b>learned how to swim? I guess I learned younger</b><b>than that. Yeah. Yeah. Cause you had to be able</b><b>to swim like 25 meters. At three.</b><b>Yeah. Wow. Was that common?</b><b>I don't think so. I think it's because just, I</b><b>had my five siblings all swimming and I would go</b><b>to every practice and then, you know, when it was</b><b>time to learn, they're like, all right, throw her</b><b>in. And I was watching so much and I was always</b><b>tall and strong for my age. Growing up, um, I was</b><b>a big guy and I just took to it. So everyone, you</b><b>were a swimming family. Yeah. That was, that</b><b>makes sense. Yeah. You're the youngest one. You</b><b>spent a lot of time at the pool then on weekends.</b><b>Yes. Yes. Was the meats and all that. Yeah. Was</b><b>that your main sport? It was my main sport. Yeah.</b><b>And like the summer we all just, you would go to</b><b>some practice at the pool seven to nine, and then</b><b>you'd just stay there. You'd have lunch. The pool</b><b>wasn't even open, I think until like 12, but</b><b>nobody cared. You just pack your food, you stay,</b><b>and then you leave at like six, seven and eight.</b><b>And that was your life. That was my life. And so</b><b>you did that from three through elementary</b><b>school, through middle school. Yep. And this was</b><b>for the town or the town had a, it was a little</b><b>private club in the town and it wasn't like a</b><b>fancy country club or anything. It was just two</b><b>pools, diving board, a slide, a baby pool, and a</b><b>swim team. And was that your main social world?</b><b>It was. Yeah. Okay. And did those friends also go</b><b>to school with you? Okay. So that's nice. Yeah.</b><b>It was fun. Yeah. And then high school, what's</b><b>the same? You swim? I swam in high school and I</b><b>still went to the club and I</b><b>was a lifeguard at that point.</b><b>Cool. Yeah. So that's a cool job. Yeah. Yeah. And</b><b>the summer, that was your</b><b>job. Right. That's awesome.</b><b>So did you end up swimming in college? I did. Did</b><b>you know you always wanted to do that? Swimming</b><b>college? No. In fact, I wanted to play soccer in</b><b>college. Um, I loved playing soccer, but I hurt</b><b>my knee. I guess my junior year in high school</b><b>and that really, um, took me back. I, so I, uh, I</b><b>actually, I can't remember if I, I, I don't think</b><b>I tried out. I think the last minute actually</b><b>asked my coach for a recommendation. I'm like,</b><b>will you write me a recommendation? I want to try</b><b>out for the soccer team at Loyola. And he, he was</b><b>like, Oh Mary, you're not the player you used to</b><b>be, you know? And I was really like, Oh, okay.</b><b>Thanks for the support there. Like, it's not</b><b>like, I don't know. I just feel like I was a</b><b>horrible move. It's a way to write that</b><b>recommendation, right? She has, she's an athlete,</b><b>high potential, but she hurt her knee. She's</b><b>worth giving a shot. Yeah. Yeah. That's the</b><b>letter. And June and junior year, that's a</b><b>pivotal year when a lot of people are figuring</b><b>out where they want to</b><b>play, especially as an athlete.</b><b>And had you been playing soccer in tandem with</b><b>swimming? Yeah. It's a soccer in the fall. And</b><b>did you do like travel soccer too? Or was it</b><b>mainly? I did travel soccer when I was young.</b><b>Actually just reminded me of that. Yeah. So you</b><b>really enjoyed soccer. I loved it, but I loved</b><b>that. I love soccer and swimming the best. I</b><b>played a bunch of sports, but those are my</b><b>favorite. Yeah. I can't believe that he said that</b><b>to you. Yeah. And it was a bummer, but it was</b><b>okay because it's not like they were even doing</b><b>scholarships. It's not like his name is in the</b><b>line for some, you know, oh, there's a couple of</b><b>scholarships on one heart. Like it was just kind</b><b>of crappy. Yeah. Um, I guess he wasn't wrong. You</b><b>know, I knew he wasn't wrong. So anyway, I just,</b><b>I didn't even, in the end, I didn't end up trying</b><b>out and I ended up swimming, which I loved and I</b><b>know I would love it. It was great. So was he</b><b>your soccer coach? He was. And was he always like</b><b>that coaching you, like where he would, you would</b><b>get those types of messages or he'd be just, No,</b><b>I did everything. He'd like, you know, he, I was</b><b>the captain. I did all the direct kicks,</b><b>everything, everything that I'm like, and I have</b><b>this recommendation and it was like, what a</b><b>shock. What a, what a shock. That is just crazy.</b><b>What did you do to your knee? I tore him.</b><b>Apparently they said I tore a muscle in my knee</b><b>and I ended up having like a full butt, a full</b><b>leg cast. And you know, and that came off my leg</b><b>was as big as my arm. And I just, it took a while</b><b>to build back muscle. And, but you know, I wasn't</b><b>like, I didn't, I don't know. I think I went to</b><b>the Y. I was like trying to do my exercises and</b><b>it just, it just didn't pan out, which was fine.</b><b>But to, to even have that opportunity to swim in</b><b>college, that was amazing. So you, you were very</b><b>natural, talented athlete to be able to have the,</b><b>cause you probably could have tried out for the</b><b>soccer team and possibly made it. To try it out.</b><b>But then to have a backup option to play, to swim</b><b>in college, you know, that's great. So what would</b><b>you, would you say back then youth sports are</b><b>different than they are now?</b><b>That's pretty funny. I, I, you know what, I don't</b><b>know because I coached my, my dad used to coach</b><b>us a lot and I was dragged to all of my siblings,</b><b>various sports. And you know, it's, people don't</b><b>really change. There's always going to be those</b><b>crazy parents, you know, that think their kids</b><b>the best or that like go ballistic on another</b><b>eight year old who, you know, whatever found</b><b>their kid and they don't think like parents,</b><b>people go crazy. So I feel like I saw that then.</b><b>And as a coach now, I kind of, well, when I</b><b>coached my daughter, like, I don't know, six</b><b>years ago, I thought, oh, this would be nice.</b><b>It'd be fun. And yeah, no, I had a mom like go</b><b>crazy on me. And what, what was she going crazy</b><b>about? We had made it to like the semi finals or</b><b>something in basketball. And I guess I don't know</b><b>if her kid was on the bench or she didn't like, I</b><b>don't even know. All I know is she, she got up,</b><b>she crossed the gym and she like to be on my side</b><b>and she stood, she stood like super close and she</b><b>just started screaming at me. And I was like,</b><b>this lady is going crazy. Oh my gosh. No, I'm, I</b><b>mean, eight year olds, eight year olds. Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. I mean, that's been our experience is that</b><b>there's some, but it's interesting that having</b><b>your dad coach so much, you probably were exposed</b><b>to a lot of that. So for you to say that was</b><b>going on back then. See, when my dad was, you</b><b>know, he was very even keel and it was like,</b><b>everybody played. If, if you ran the laps, if you</b><b>didn't run the laps and you don't play, like it</b><b>was very like, you know, it's fair. Yes. Yeah.</b><b>And, uh, but there were always parents that</b><b>would, you know, be crazy. I remember. Yeah. I</b><b>mean, just the parents of other kids being crazy.</b><b>So would you say as far as if somebody's going to</b><b>play a sport in college, do they need to be</b><b>passionate about that sport? Is what kind of</b><b>commitment do you have to make when you're in</b><b>college playing a sport?</b><b>Well, yeah, you definitely have to, you have to</b><b>like what you do. You have to like it. So I loved</b><b>it. And I, and I loved the social aspect of it</b><b>too. You know, it was more than just time times</b><b>and winning and records or whatever, whatever the</b><b>goals were in the pool. It was also part of a</b><b>team and swimming is pretty cool sport because</b><b>it's, um, it's men and women mixed, you know,</b><b>when you're practicing and, and it's a big team</b><b>for that reason. So, um, to answer your question,</b><b>I think that if you're going to do something</b><b>well, you've got to have some passion for it. You</b><b>got to enjoy it. But with sports, at least for</b><b>me, I was also super focused on just having fun.</b><b>I always had fun. There was never a time when I'm</b><b>like, Oh, I don't want to swim. I'm so burned</b><b>out. Okay. I doubt that's not really my</b><b>personality. Yeah. So, but you need to enjoy it.</b><b>The sport. Let's put it this way. Okay. If I</b><b>enjoyed it less, I probably would have been a</b><b>better swimmer if I enjoyed the social aspect</b><b>less and I enjoy, you know, I would have been a</b><b>better swimmer than I was. Um, but that's just</b><b>not my personality. I, I, I was having fun too.</b><b>We, it was most of your social world, the</b><b>swimmers, the swimming world at college.</b><b>And that typically happens when you play a sport</b><b>in college, right? Does most of your social world</b><b>become the people that are also on that, those</b><b>teams? I think so. Cause you're with them so much</b><b>and you'd have pre-season and then you have</b><b>season and then there, and then the season is so</b><b>long and then you have championships. It goes on</b><b>and on. Is it year round pretty much the whole</b><b>time you're there? I mean, I think our</b><b>championships were like in March, early March,</b><b>end of February, but we started even before</b><b>school started in August. Okay. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>That's the whole time. And would you have a</b><b>morning practices like before classes? Yeah.</b><b>Morning and afternoon. So two days, two days.</b><b>Sometimes it was optional. Okay.</b><b>So yeah, that's a huge commitment.</b><b>Is optional truly optional? Yeah. I was just</b><b>laughing. I was like, I should</b><b>have done two days more. I didn't.</b><b>And then also there was what we call on swimming</b><b>dry land where you go and you're lifting weights</b><b>and you're doing, and that was kind of like, that</b><b>also would have immensely helped my swimming, but</b><b>who wants to do that? Yeah. But I mean, the fact</b><b>that you were still able to make the team be on</b><b>the team and without the a hundred percent or</b><b>120% effort, that's impressive. That means you</b><b>were very, more about the team. I don't know. I</b><b>think there's probably, I think you were probably</b><b>a natural athlete. You had to have been to be</b><b>able to even maintain without doing everything. I</b><b>mean, that's pretty impressive. Did you swim all</b><b>four years? Yeah. That's impressive too. Cause a</b><b>lot of people like get burned out and we'll stop.</b><b>Oh, see, I didn't get burned out cause I always,</b><b>I didn't, maybe I would have gotten burned out if</b><b>I did the two days, I did every dry land and it</b><b>would have been a lot, but I was able to find</b><b>that balance. That's awesome. Yeah. Now did all</b><b>your siblings do sports in college?</b><b>Yeah, actually. No, my oldest sister didn't, she</b><b>swam on her own. Like she did. It didn't do the</b><b>team. My brother played basketball.</b><b>My other two sisters then went to lay a little on</b><b>the swim team. And then my sister who went to St.</b><b>Joe's, uh, St. Joseph university, she ended up</b><b>doing crew. Okay. Wow. Wow. So was your, were</b><b>your parents collegiate athletes? Um, my dad was</b><b>an excellent athlete, but he, um, he went to</b><b>college later after like he basically met my, was</b><b>with my mom. And my mom was like, um, if you want</b><b>to marry me, you need to get your college</b><b>education. And he was like, Oh, all right, let me</b><b>do that. What did they mean? They went to high</b><b>school together and they actually ended up going</b><b>on a blind date with other people. Okay. And then</b><b>they went apart. My mom went to college back</b><b>then. I think, I don't think a lot of women were</b><b>going to college. Um, and my dad didn't have a</b><b>lot of money, didn't know what to do. So he went</b><b>to the army. Wow. Yeah. And then when he came</b><b>back from the army four years later, I guess my</b><b>mom had graduated college and he came back from</b><b>the army. Um, they were at the same wedding and</b><b>that's where they really met. Did in the same</b><b>town where you were born? No, they, they were</b><b>from North Jersey. So my dad grew up in Wippany</b><b>and my mom was in Providence. Okay. Okay. All</b><b>right. Wippany's legit like seven miles from</b><b>Sparta. Okay. Yeah. From where we lived. Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. So did he, um, what</b><b>years was he in the army?</b><b>If you had to guess.</b><b>I don't know. He was born in 37.</b><b>So what's 57, you know, so probably 55 around</b><b>that time. Were there, was there anything? No, it</b><b>sounds like Keith probably was my dad's age ish</b><b>and he got to miss all the world war one and two,</b><b>obviously. Yeah. And then too young or, uh, the</b><b>Korean war was it was, it would have been like</b><b>Korean war or Vietnam, but it sounds like he</b><b>missed both. Wow. That's wonderful. I mean, yeah.</b><b>So then he came back. Met my mom at a wedding and</b><b>then that was that. And then she said, if you</b><b>want to get married, you need a college degree.</b><b>You need a college degree. And so then he did</b><b>that. He did that. So she was working as a</b><b>teacher and he went to college, but he had played</b><b>baseball in the army and that was his main sport,</b><b>I guess, as baseball. And how impressive that</b><b>your mom went to college, because like you said</b><b>at that time, that was not a thing. I mean, women</b><b>did, but it wasn't the norm.</b><b>So do you know what she went to school for? Yeah,</b><b>she was, she, uh, home economics. Okay. Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. I don't even think they have that anymore.</b><b>Was it four years? It was. She went to St.</b><b>Elizabeth's college. Okay. College of St.</b><b>Elizabeth's. College of St. Thank you. Right.</b><b>Yeah. So four years for sure. And then she worked</b><b>until she, they started the family, their family.</b><b>Yeah, exactly. So where'd the swimming come from?</b><b>I don't know. My mom was probably like, what am I</b><b>going to do with these kids? That's a great way</b><b>to burn energy. Right. Yeah. I'm going to put</b><b>them in a pool. I think so. I think so. That</b><b>makes sense though. Yeah. Yeah. And then she</b><b>could just have everybody together. Yeah. You're</b><b>still on the pool. Yeah. I just think it's so</b><b>impressive though, that most of your family</b><b>played sports in college, that's, I think that's</b><b>unusual to have that many</b><b>siblings place sports in college.</b><b>I guess. I don't know. I think it is. Right. That</b><b>the statistically. I know another family that had</b><b>all their kids play. They were all tall and one,</b><b>and one actually made it to the professional NBA.</b><b>Yeah. So it's, it's rare though. It's very rare.</b><b>Yeah. So, I mean, your parent, your parents</b><b>somewhere in there, the DNA, there's some good</b><b>athletic genes in there. They were both pretty</b><b>athletic, even though my mom didn't really do</b><b>sports. Well, she did synchronize swimming now</b><b>that I think about it. Okay. Yeah. There you go.</b><b>Yeah. So she had, she was familiar with that and</b><b>had all these kids and</b><b>she's like, I know something.</b><b>Let's do this. Yeah. Okay. So what did you go to</b><b>school for at Loyola? Oh, I majored in English</b><b>and I did a minor in secondary education and that</b><b>minor in secondary education was not for a lot of</b><b>education. It was because everyone in my family,</b><b>all of my siblings got their masters or beyond</b><b>and after college, and I would watch them all</b><b>come back to the house. And my parents paid for</b><b>college and we had to pay for grad school. And so</b><b>everybody came home, lived at home, had no money,</b><b>you know, were students.</b><b>And I was just like, I don't want to do that. I</b><b>do not want to come back after college. Yeah. So</b><b>what job can I do where I don't need a, um, a</b><b>master's or a whatever. And I thought, oh, okay.</b><b>I could teach. And that's what I did. So you saw</b><b>all your siblings come back and live back at home</b><b>while they're getting their masters and you</b><b>decided, okay, that's not for me. Were you always</b><b>kind of taking your own path?</b><b>I mean, in some ways I think so. Um, but I think</b><b>part of that is being the youngest of six, like</b><b>saw so many paths already taken. So it wasn't</b><b>such this brave new world to me. I'm like, okay,</b><b>if you do that, that's what happens next. If she</b><b>does that, then that's, I saw her deal with that,</b><b>you know, you know? So I feel like I had</b><b>experienced through my siblings. Yeah. Yeah,</b><b>absolutely. So what did you do when you</b><b>graduated? Oh, so I got a teaching job. I moved</b><b>to Maryland. I got an apartment. I got a Nissan</b><b>Sentra and I had my first job. Why did you move</b><b>to Maryland? That's where I got a job. Okay. In</b><b>New Jersey, you have to apply like school by</b><b>school, district by district. In Maryland, you</b><b>send one application out to the county and it</b><b>covers every school in the county. Okay. So it</b><b>was just much easier to apply to schools in</b><b>Maryland. Absolutely. So you were a high school</b><b>English teacher. It was. What</b><b>grade? 9th and 11th. How'd that go?</b><b>It was, you know, it was, I liked it. I did like</b><b>it a lot. I could, I, I love the kids I did. I</b><b>love the teaching moments that I did love, but</b><b>it's a lot of testing and it was tough because it</b><b>was a kind of a tough school and a lot of it, I</b><b>think based the statistic was 25% went to four</b><b>year college, 25% went to like a two year and 50%</b><b>went into the workforce. What town were you in?</b><b>It was in Edgewood, Edgewood, Maryland. I'm not</b><b>familiar with it. No, it's in Baltimore County.</b><b>Okay. Um, nice kids, nice people. Super nice. I</b><b>really enjoyed it a lot. Um, was it blue collar</b><b>with that type of, uh, college distribution?</b><b>Yeah. Yeah. So how long did you do that? Two</b><b>years. Two years and talk about burnout. I did</b><b>get burned out with English and I was kind of</b><b>anal about it because I would like have them</b><b>write and write and you know, every comma and</b><b>period and misspelled this, I, I, I am the</b><b>English teacher. Like you can't let that stuff</b><b>go. So, but I'm up till two, three in the</b><b>morning, grading papers and reading journals and</b><b>doing these things. And then, and then, you know,</b><b>you go to open up your drawer for lesson plans.</b><b>It's empty because you're not, you're just</b><b>starting off and then you got to create the</b><b>lesson plans and read the books you haven't read</b><b>in however many years. It's a lot of work being a</b><b>teacher. I give teachers so much credit. It is a</b><b>very difficult job. Yeah. Um, because you're</b><b>giving of yourself so much. And then</b><b>I always imagine then the teachers that have</b><b>children at home. So you've given of yourself all</b><b>day teaching to other people's children and not</b><b>just teaching academically, but there's might be</b><b>personal things going on that they need your help</b><b>with or just that emotional support. And then you</b><b>go home and your children need all that and your</b><b>spouse, if you're married and, and then you</b><b>somehow maybe try to find some time for yourself</b><b>or some self care, maybe I can only imagine the</b><b>burnout, you know, if you really think about it,</b><b>if you're trying to raise a family and all that</b><b>as a teacher. So, so two years and you were like,</b><b>two years, I lost it. Two years. And I can't do</b><b>this anymore. So then what did you, did you get</b><b>start getting a backup job before you left? Or</b><b>what did you do? Oh, I was like, Oh man, I've</b><b>always wanted to be an actress. That's, I always</b><b>always wanted to be in theater and, but I never</b><b>did. Cause I was, I was in sports and I've, I</b><b>think New York city is really cool. I'd love to</b><b>live in New York city. So I quit my job and I,</b><b>that's what I did. I think I went on Craigslist.</b><b>I found a friend of mine helped me find a, Wait,</b><b>was Craigslist around then? Had to have been,</b><b>cause I remember a friend of mine found this</b><b>apartment for me, a four floor walk up. And I</b><b>didn't even know what</b><b>that meant. I'm like, great.</b><b>Keep in mind, she's a couple of years, three</b><b>years younger than us. Yeah. So maybe Craigslist</b><b>has been around forever. Has it really guys,</b><b>wait, had you, cause I know Brian growing up in</b><b>Jersey, he would sneak into the city and so he</b><b>was familiar with the city. Did you also go in</b><b>the city? Our city to sneak into was Philly. So</b><b>you weren't familiar with New York? Only from</b><b>going up to watch my brother's basketball games.</b><b>Okay. Yeah. So this really was going to</b><b>experience living in the city unknown. Would you,</b><b>is that a thing to do? Sneak in the affiliate and</b><b>go, where do you go? Like down by temple and St.</b><b>Joe's. South street. Okay. Did you do that?</b><b>Mm-hmm. A little, not a ton, but a little. Did</b><b>you buy fireworks like Brian did? No.</b><b>I do have to ask, did your, being the youngest,</b><b>did your older siblings buy you booze or other</b><b>things when you were growing up at all? Or</b><b>because you were all athletic? You know, we</b><b>really were like very PG family. Like, no, it</b><b>wasn't boozing or, you know, a couple little</b><b>sneak out things like that, but it wasn't, and it</b><b>was nothing like that. Like I hear my other</b><b>friends talk about their high school times. Like,</b><b>Oh, you know, and I was thinking I didn't do</b><b>that. So in high school, you weren't, you weren't</b><b>partying. No, you weren't like a Gen Xter that</b><b>was like drunk in a field somewhere in your</b><b>parents that you're spending the night. Never. So</b><b>she had the parents that kept an eye. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. I tricked you. You know, which is, you</b><b>know, there are Gen Xers who had that upbringing.</b><b>You know, there's just so many of us. I just</b><b>don't know any of them. Now we've met one. That</b><b>had my upbringing. Yeah. Yeah. Because so many</b><b>parents, whether it was, I don't, just the</b><b>attitude of, I don't know, the boomer attitude,</b><b>the, the silent gen attitude, or there were a lot</b><b>of divorce was happening then. So you had a lot</b><b>of women going into the workforce, single moms.</b><b>Um, and so there wasn't a lot of supervision. My</b><b>mom was just like, she was on it. She's like, no,</b><b>you can't go. She's how we are. That's how she</b><b>is. Yeah. Yeah. Go. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Or if</b><b>something was going on, I'm picking you up at</b><b>nine 30. Yeah. Nine 30. Yeah. Yeah. And that's</b><b>how it was. Yeah. That was so, okay. So you, you</b><b>got this apartment and you go in without a job.</b><b>Mm hmm. The city. Yeah. I didn't have a job.</b><b>Right. What are you like 20? I was thinking that</b><b>22, 24. I taught for two years. So yeah, I was</b><b>like 20. No, I was like 22, 23. Mm hmm. Wow. I'm</b><b>kind of young for my, like I'm a September</b><b>birthday. So yeah, I think I was like 22, 23.</b><b>And, um, I had a family member, like an, or uncle</b><b>that would, we're not related, but we call them</b><b>an uncle. Um, who had a daughter who was an</b><b>editor, I think for a Spanish version of people</b><b>magazine, I don't know. And she knew someone in</b><b>the city who was a fashion stylist and this</b><b>person who knew her name was Holly, she needed an</b><b>assistant. Okay. I was like, great, I'll do it.</b><b>Yeah. And so that was really my first job as an</b><b>assistant fashion stylist. Um, to Holly. And so</b><b>you took that job and then did you</b><b>continue to try to pursue acting?</b><b>Um, not at that time. Like I was so new and I</b><b>just had to get like to figure out where I was</b><b>and like how much stuff cost. And which I'm sure</b><b>even back then the city was expensive. Was it</b><b>ever not expensive? No, it's always been always</b><b>insanely expensive. Yeah. Was it a nine to five</b><b>job or if you were an assistant, was it 24 seven?</b><b>It's like you, you work and get paid or you're</b><b>broke. So it's like when she's calling me, okay,</b><b>we have a five day shoot here. You know, and I</b><b>would just get a daily wage and then that would</b><b>be that. And then I just pray that she'd call me</b><b>within the next week or two for another gig. So</b><b>what would you do like with that job as a fashion</b><b>stylist? It was my job. Yeah. What was your job?</b><b>My job was to iron the clothes, steam the</b><b>clothes, which by the way, I'm horrible at that</b><b>stuff, but that's what I did. She showed me how I</b><b>got the steam or I steam the clothes, dress the</b><b>models. Okay. Um, at one point it was my job.</b><b>Like after like a year or two, it was my job to</b><b>actually book the models, which is funny because</b><b>I remember one time I was on a, um, a photo</b><b>shoot, you know, I'd ordered lunch, I just, I was</b><b>like the gopher and, um, I ordered lunch and we</b><b>were on a location somewhere and one of the</b><b>models was like in the woods having a cigarette</b><b>and I didn't get his lunch order and I got</b><b>everybody's lunch order. And I, you know, there's</b><b>no delivery then, you know, you're going to do</b><b>all this stuff and get it yourself and whatever.</b><b>And I came back and I'm handing everybody. Their</b><b>meals and I, and I'm like, Oh my God, I'm so</b><b>sorry. I forgot. I didn't see you. You must have</b><b>been out having a cigarette.</b><b>You can have my lunch. He's like, okay.</b><b>I was like, Oh, and he was such a jerk about it.</b><b>And, um, like here he is making like $3,000 a</b><b>day, you know, whatever. It's fine. He's right. I</b><b>didn't order his lunch, but he's such a</b><b>non-gentleman about it. But like, lo and behold,</b><b>um, a couple of months later, it was my job to</b><b>hire the models and I'm going through the</b><b>headshots. And I'm like, Nope, Nope. To that one.</b><b>Isn't that funny? You said the moral of the</b><b>story. You always got to be good to the little</b><b>people. Yes. It's so, so true because what comes</b><b>around goes around, what comes around goes</b><b>around. So true. So were these models for that</b><b>magazine? It was just, uh, that was a cat. We did</b><b>a lot of catalog stuff. Oh, yeah. So, so you were</b><b>just kind of doing everything and just running</b><b>around ordering food, ironing clothes, like, and</b><b>then hiring models. Yeah. So hiring, how do you</b><b>know who's a good model and who isn't? Like, how</b><b>do you hire a model? She knew he was an asshole.</b><b>Well, she knew he was an asshole, but like, if</b><b>they gave you a sec, how do you judge that? Uh,</b><b>well, you have to just like mix it up. Like</b><b>you're not going to get everybody with brown hair</b><b>or everybody who's blind, you know, you gotta do</b><b>different ethnicities, different coloring, some,</b><b>you know, it's just something that looks</b><b>interesting together that fits the vibe. And then</b><b>of course, some specific things you need someone</b><b>who, if you know, if you're going to, someone's</b><b>got to write a moped or something, you know,</b><b>you're going to have certain skillsets or</b><b>whatever. So, okay. Was that fun? Did you enjoy</b><b>that? Super fun. I actually liked that a lot.</b><b>Were you making more money? Like, was that a</b><b>promotion? It was just more hours to work. So it</b><b>was just more money. Um, then how long did you do</b><b>that? I did that for about two years. And then</b><b>something happened with the economy and, um,</b><b>people were not hiring Holly as much because they</b><b>didn't want to pay her rate. And so they hired me</b><b>at a little bit more than I was making as her</b><b>assistant, but not as much as she was making.</b><b>And that was a little weird night. Like asked</b><b>her, like, are you okay with this? You know, they</b><b>hopped over to get to you. Yeah. Yeah. And, um, I</b><b>asked her, I mean, I remember, I was talking</b><b>about this stuff now. I'm remembering, you know,</b><b>some things that went down, but yeah. Um, was she</b><b>mad? Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I was mad too, because I</b><b>asked her if it was okay. And then she was like,</b><b>yeah, it's totally fine. And so I did it. And</b><b>then she was like, well, I'm never hiring you</b><b>again. And I'm like, but</b><b>wait a second. I asked you.</b><b>I asked you. And so anyway, and then, um, so then</b><b>I started not, I started being the stylist and</b><b>that was fun, but it wasn't really what I wanted</b><b>to do. So, and I think at that point, that's when</b><b>I started probably taking acting lessons and</b><b>courses. And then I walked like a couple blocks</b><b>from my apartment to try to figure out where I</b><b>could get some money. And of course, waiting</b><b>tables and bartending and stuff like that. So</b><b>kind of transitioned out of the stylist and into.</b><b>It's kind of a New York lifestyle, right? You</b><b>just hustle. Yeah, that's what you do. You just</b><b>hustle. You hustle to pay the rent. That's what</b><b>you do. Yeah. So you were, you were stylists and</b><b>then you were going out on additions?</b><b>Um, not at that point. Cause I didn't have an</b><b>agent. I was just, um, making, you know, cash,</b><b>working as a bartender, um, waitress and taking</b><b>these classes. And then, and then I guess I did</b><b>get an agent. I was actually, I don't know. I</b><b>don't even remember how I think you just send</b><b>your headshots out at that point. And then people</b><b>either accept, say I'll be your agent or. Yeah.</b><b>Or not. Or they don't hear from them or they're</b><b>like, okay, come in. We want to meet you. And</b><b>then they'll say, okay. And then you had, you</b><b>said you had taken acting classes.</b><b>How are those? Really fun. Those are fun. Um, are</b><b>you still friends with anyone that you met in</b><b>those classes? No, I haven't. Did you actually</b><b>learn things? Yeah. I learned a lot cause I</b><b>didn't know anything. Okay. Cause I've never even</b><b>done theater or nothing. And they're like, this</b><b>is the fourth wall. You know what I mean? I was</b><b>like, okay. Like I didn't know anything. And how</b><b>do you feel you did acting?</b><b>Um, I don't know. I think I was okay. Um, I don't</b><b>think I was like great. It was just, it was just</b><b>fun. It was just something I wanted to try. It</b><b>was just fun. Actually I did get an audition for</b><b>like my dream job, dream job. Did you ever watch,</b><b>um, soap operas? Yeah. Okay. So did you Brian</b><b>soap operas? Oh yeah. I'm Jen</b><b>Hex, latch key, whatever. Yeah.</b><b>Parents watch one guiding light. Oh yeah. Okay.</b><b>So that was the one I was obsessed with. My</b><b>sister was my mom and I like obsessed and I don't</b><b>know how somehow I got an addition for that show.</b><b>Wow. Yeah. And so I was, I was so beyond excited</b><b>and I went to the audition and I sat and I sat</b><b>and I sat and I sat in like three hours later,</b><b>this, this lady at the desk comes back and she's</b><b>like, Oh, you're still here. She's like, wait,</b><b>who are you here to see? And I, I told her, and,</b><b>and anyway, there was a mix up with the schedule.</b><b>And so, and I was there for three. I imagine</b><b>like, you know, by then, I was so nervous. So did</b><b>they not have you on their schedule? No. So</b><b>another lesson learned here. So they, they, the</b><b>woman who was, I was supposed to have the</b><b>addition with came out, was like, I'm really</b><b>sorry. And, um, there was like,</b><b>you know, mix up in the schedule.</b><b>Can you come back? Do you want to come back?</b><b>She's like, you can do it now. You can come back.</b><b>And I was like, I want to do it now. I want to do</b><b>it now. Which I should have said, I'll come back.</b><b>I should have said that because I was already</b><b>like spent with like energy and nerves and my</b><b>mascara is probably halfway down my face by then.</b><b>And my hair was flat and I was just tired. And,</b><b>you know, but I was just, you were drained. Yeah,</b><b>I was trained. And, um, but I, I just wanted it</b><b>so badly. I was like, no, no, I'm going to do it.</b><b>And I remember she kept asking me, like I did the</b><b>scene and then she said, okay, now can you do it</b><b>like this? And I'm like, uh-huh. And I, and I saw</b><b>myself doing it the exact same way, like again</b><b>and again. And she's like, okay, can you give me</b><b>a little more of this? Do it like, and I didn't,</b><b>I just didn't. Probably because you didn't have</b><b>it in you anymore. You were depleted. I was</b><b>depleted. And I just was so focused on getting it</b><b>done, I guess. And then I didn't get the job.</b><b>But, um, When you're doing that, are you reading</b><b>with just one person or is there like a</b><b>particular, it was just she and I. So how many of</b><b>those types of auditions did you go out on? Not</b><b>many, not many at all. That was like, that would</b><b>have been a big one break. And again, I don't</b><b>even know how I got that one. I mean, you know,</b><b>you're, you're mailing stuff out to networks and</b><b>this and that. I don't know how I got that, but,</b><b>um, I blew it. It wasn't meant to be. And, uh,</b><b>and your wait, just seeing and bartending at the</b><b>same time. At any particular restaurant that's</b><b>still there or just random. No, if it's still</b><b>there. Do you remember where</b><b>you were living at the time?</b><b>Yeah. So my first apartment was at four floor</b><b>walk up, um, on 89th and I</b><b>think it was on second or third.</b><b>That was horrific. And then, um, it was like a</b><b>railroad apartment, a long skinny apartment. It's</b><b>a nice area. I was in the middle and like in bed</b><b>and then, um, was your apartment the size of like</b><b>smaller than this room or the size of this room?</b><b>The apartment itself might've been bigger than</b><b>this room, but my spot was like, you know,</b><b>probably where Brian and I to the wall. So small.</b><b>Yeah. Were you living with other people? Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. Yeah. Oh, it wasn't just my spot. No, you</b><b>almost have to. Yeah. How many people were you</b><b>living with? Just one girl. And she needed a</b><b>roommate. And then I always lived on the Upper</b><b>East Side. And then by the end, um, when I</b><b>actually had jobs and was doing well before I</b><b>moved to Florida, I was on a 87th in Lexington.</b><b>That's cool. Yeah. So you're waitressing, you're</b><b>bartending, you're hoping for auditions. Yeah.</b><b>And how long did you do that? Oh God, I don't</b><b>know. Probably another two years. And then I was</b><b>like, all right, I'm tired of this hustle. I</b><b>mean, I'd like a paycheck. I'd like a little bit</b><b>of security. And, um, that's when I started, uh,</b><b>becoming a assistant salesperson in the garment</b><b>district, which actually happened through one of</b><b>my jobs that I got, um, working for a bongo</b><b>jeans. So that, wait, so go back. What the bongo</b><b>jeans, what's that? So the bongo jeans. Um, so I</b><b>got sent on a ghost and they needed a showroom</b><b>model, just someone to wear the jeans while</b><b>they're selling the, selling the jeans to their</b><b>buyers that come in. So I did that. And, um, it</b><b>was great, great, great job because I was in</b><b>like, if like, say you gave a presentation, I</b><b>would be modeling for you and then Brian gave a</b><b>ride, so I'd hear how you presented, how he</b><b>presented, like all of the salespeople to the</b><b>president. I got to hear everybody's</b><b>presentations and I learned a lot about the</b><b>jeans, the product, how to sell presentations,</b><b>the whole thing. And so after doing that for</b><b>probably another two years, I asked for, Hey, can</b><b>I work here, you know, I'd be an assistant. So</b><b>the bongo jeans modeling gig was a two year job</b><b>that you, or was that just like one of the gigs</b><b>you would go out on? Just one of the gigs, but it</b><b>was my most regular. Yeah. It was like every</b><b>month I was there. So you would be live wearing</b><b>the jeans where they could see you in the jeans.</b><b>Oh, that's cool. So as they're doing a sales</b><b>presentation, you're standing there. Yeah. So</b><b>they'd have like a whole rack of the line and</b><b>they'd be like, and the buyer would say, I don't</b><b>know about those. Oh, Mary, throw them on. I'm</b><b>like, okay, here's what they're looking at. You</b><b>know, wow. Stuff on looks a lot different than</b><b>just hanging. Yeah. That was fun. And I met one</b><b>of my best friends at that job who I'm still</b><b>best. Okay. That's cool. So that, okay, really</b><b>quick. So the buyers are maybe from like Macy's</b><b>or Nordstrom where. That's exactly where they're</b><b>from. Okay. Okay. Cool. All over the nation. I</b><b>didn't know they did that where they'd have</b><b>models right there. It's New York fashion</b><b>district. I guess that makes sense. That's cool.</b><b>So in addition to going out on auditions for</b><b>acting, you were also getting modeling. Yeah, I</b><b>did end up getting some of those, which I wasn't,</b><b>you know, I, I wasn't thinking I was going to do</b><b>that, but then the Bongo thing became very</b><b>consistent. And then I gave up on the acting</b><b>thing. It was just too much where I was probably</b><b>spending more money on taxis and subways than I</b><b>was like on anything. Yeah. I just stopped doing</b><b>that. And, um, and that's when I wanted, yeah, to</b><b>become. All right. Were there, are there any</b><b>interesting stories from your modeling days?</b><b>Besides the Bongo, that's interesting, but it</b><b>didn't anything else happen.</b><b>Cause modeling in New York, I can only imagine</b><b>that's quite an adventure. Yeah. It wasn't</b><b>adventure. It was an adventure. I, yeah, it was a</b><b>lot of, a lot of, um, I did a lot of random</b><b>stuff. Like I did like wedding for some reason. I</b><b>booked a lot of wedding showroom things. Okay.</b><b>Um, that was fun. And, um, I did like, just, I</b><b>actually was in swimming magazine or swimmer</b><b>magazine, something I did some swimming things</b><b>and some fitness things and other magazines. And</b><b>were you in any, like, um, like Cosmo or any of</b><b>those magazines? Cosmo was one of the first jobs</b><b>I booked. And that was just a big one. It was a</b><b>big one. It was, um, it was a, um, I got called</b><b>to go and I almost didn't go. I was like, I am</b><b>not going to an addition for Cosmopolitan</b><b>magazine. Like I'm not doing this. I'm, you know,</b><b>why, why did you hesitate? Because like Cosmo,</b><b>these are models. Like they're five, 10, they're</b><b>beautiful. Like this is, this is what they're</b><b>doing with their lives, you know? And I'm just</b><b>taking some acting classes and throwing on jeans.</b><b>I'm like, I'm not going to Cosmopolitan. This is</b><b>nuts. You had like imposter syndrome a little</b><b>bit. Totally, totally. I was like, what am I</b><b>doing? I don't have a book. You have to have this</b><b>book with all these tear sheets and all these</b><b>things that you've done. Like, I haven't done</b><b>anything. So I went there and, um, in the Conde</b><b>Nast building up on whatever floor. And, um, I</b><b>was like, I think I showed a headshot that I had.</b><b>I didn't even have any modeling pictures, you</b><b>know, cause the bongo thing was live. And anyway,</b><b>they're like, okay, yeah, go into this room. And</b><b>we just want you to show this to women. Like, we</b><b>just want you to try on this outfit. I'm like,</b><b>oh, okay. That's fine. Teeny, tiny outfit, like a</b><b>little teeny, lacy boy short and a little crop</b><b>thing. And I was now even more horrified and</b><b>embarrassed. And I just, there's no way I'm</b><b>putting this on. Like, is it like lingerie</b><b>almost? Pretty much. I mean, it was, yeah, it was</b><b>cute. It was tasteful, but yeah, it was very</b><b>skimpy, like kind of fluorescent lights. It's two</b><b>people. I don't even know. Yeah. And you never,</b><b>um, modeled something like that before. No, no.</b><b>This wasn't, thank God they weren't taking</b><b>pictures. This was just, they just wanted to see</b><b>what I looked like. Yeah. And I remember being in</b><b>the bathroom like, how do I get out of this? How</b><b>do I, I tell them I puked. Like, I, how do I get</b><b>out of this? I can't walk out there. I'm not,</b><b>not. And I was probably in there for like 10</b><b>minutes. Like, wow, you're taking a long time to,</b><b>there wasn't that much to that outfit.</b><b>Totally, totally. And then, um, I finally was</b><b>like, oh my God, I just walked out, like probably</b><b>with the worst, like just head down, like, okay,</b><b>here. I was like, okay. They're like, okay. I'm</b><b>like, okay. And then they said, well, can you</b><b>just turn around? Can you just do a 360? And then</b><b>I was like, this is, could this get any worse?</b><b>Like, what's you seriously? So I stand, I do the</b><b>360. Then I'm like, good, we're good. We're okay.</b><b>Great. I ran back to the bathroom, got dressed.</b><b>I'm out. And back then, I think I had a beeper or</b><b>a blackberry. I don't know what I had, but by the</b><b>time I was just a couple blocks, my agent called</b><b>me and was like, oh, Mary, you booked the job for</b><b>Cosmo. Wow. I was like, what? That's cool. That's</b><b>cool. Yeah. And, and, um, that was cool, but I</b><b>was, I was the one and only time, but the moral</b><b>of that story that I told that story to my</b><b>daughter before is like, don't tell yourself, no,</b><b>even if just let someone else tell you, no, if I</b><b>didn't, if you don't get it, you don't get it.</b><b>You know, there's a lot of things you're not</b><b>going to get, but you can take that into almost</b><b>any aspect of life. Anything that is huge. Don't</b><b>tell, don't tell yourself, no, let someone else</b><b>tell you, no, that's just, just go, just do it.</b><b>Just do it. Cause you just don't know. No. Yeah.</b><b>Has that, has that stuck with you? Totally.</b><b>Totally, totally. Totally. Enough to tell your</b><b>daughter. Uh-huh. Yeah. Enough to tell her.</b><b>That's a, that's a great lesson. Cause that is a</b><b>great lesson that any age can adapt to or adopt</b><b>in their life. I mean, that's just any situation.</b><b>Like don't tell yourself, no, just, just go for</b><b>it. Yeah. Worst case scenario, it's, it is a no.</b><b>And then you learn like, okay, I can do something</b><b>different or this isn't for me or whatever. Yeah.</b><b>I, that's a huge lesson for me. So how long did,</b><b>so you said about two years you did the modeling,</b><b>the acting. I feel like everything's been on kind</b><b>of a two year rotation. I don't know. Like test</b><b>it out for two years. You're like, okay, I did</b><b>that. Seems like it. And then you, and then you</b><b>got the job as the sales. Yeah. So then I was an</b><b>assistant salesperson and then that grew into an</b><b>actual salesperson. I was probably there for</b><b>another two years and then that grow. And then I</b><b>ended up to be an actual sales executive there,</b><b>which I loved. Wow. Love, love, loved. So you've</b><b>been in the city at this point, what eight years,</b><b>would you say since you got there, so good. Yeah.</b><b>Right about then. So most of your twenties, all</b><b>your twenties pretty much. Um, and what was the,</b><b>what years was that in the city? What'd you say?</b><b>That was almost the golden era. That's like the</b><b>nineties. Giuliani was probably married. That's</b><b>what I was taking. Nathan was safe back then. It</b><b>was fine. It was beautiful. It was clean. I used</b><b>to take Nathan and Kyanne like just them. And I</b><b>would have this parking garage that only charged</b><b>$11 all day. And then we would cab it everywhere.</b><b>And I would, that's when Toys R Us was in Times</b><b>Square. Like there were Mars 21 12 that</b><b>restaurant where it's like, you were living a</b><b>different life than me. So there's no reason for</b><b>you to go to Mars 21 12, but it was like this,</b><b>uh, the restaurant was like Mars</b><b>and there were aliens and stuff.</b><b>Yeah. Yeah. So it was like, I could take young</b><b>children and feel so safe. It was a, you were</b><b>there in one of the best times of the city. That</b><b>I can think of. Yeah. Were you there for a nine</b><b>11? Yeah, I was there. Were you?</b><b>So, um, can you share your nine 11 story the day</b><b>that that happened? I was at Bongo and that was</b><b>in the garment district. So their place was on</b><b>40th. I think it's between six and Broadway or</b><b>six and seven. I can't remember. So 40th. And,</b><b>uh, I just, we had the TVs on. It was between,</b><b>um, between clients, between buyers coming.</b><b>And that was it. We were just like, oh my God.</b><b>Someone, you know, just blew a plane into the</b><b>towers. It was crazy. I almost looked like, what</b><b>is the fake? And then you see, you started seeing</b><b>smoke and smelling and everything, but I was far</b><b>enough from it that. You</b><b>could smell the smoke though.</b><b>After a while, I don't remember how long and I</b><b>think I had to walk home. So I was living on the</b><b>upper East side and you know, nothing was</b><b>running. No, subways, no buses, nothing. So you</b><b>had to walk and, uh, yeah, it was stunk. What was</b><b>the, um, when you were out on the sidewalk</b><b>walking, was everyone just kind of in shock?</b><b>Yeah. That's a good way to put it. No one's</b><b>really talking to each other. It was kind of</b><b>eerie and, um, scary and panicky, but like a calm</b><b>panic, kind of everyone was just kind of like,</b><b>nobody really knew what to do. I feel like, you</b><b>know, or how to get to where they needed to go.</b><b>Yeah. And was the city pretty quiet for, was</b><b>really quiet. I think that's why it was for a few</b><b>weeks. Would you say after that happened? Yeah.</b><b>So, um, he actually went in what few days after</b><b>to help two days later to help set something up</b><b>and, uh, but I think that was the only activity</b><b>was down there. I imagine that, I mean, it's New</b><b>York, right? It never sleeps. It never stops, but</b><b>the quietness is, I remember it was kind of</b><b>ominous. It's like people were just wasn't that</b><b>happy that hustle bustle. It's still there, but</b><b>yeah, we set up, what did we set up here? 94, I</b><b>think it was the DNA, the DNA, the DNA collection</b><b>for the people who died. And the towers, their</b><b>families were bringing toothbrushes and brushes.</b><b>They were hoping to find people DNA stuff. Yeah.</b><b>It was the whole thing. So, so, um, did you then</b><b>not go to work for how long were you not going to</b><b>work after that happened?</b><b>Like how long did it shut down?</b><b>I remember kind of a blur. Yeah. I think it is</b><b>for pretty much everyone that was in the city at</b><b>that time. So you were there through nine 11. Um,</b><b>were you an exec, a sales executive? Was that</b><b>your last job in the city?</b><b>Yes.</b><b>And then had you had it with the city? Like what</b><b>made you move? I had had it. Like I was ready. I,</b><b>at that point, um, you know, it was fun, but I</b><b>was ready for the next stage in my life. I wanted</b><b>to, you know, I wanted to experience something a</b><b>little slower, get out of the city. And my</b><b>parents had always had a time share down here in</b><b>Florida and I would come every year and I was</b><b>like, man, I don't really want to live down here.</b><b>How do I live down here? My dad's like work. You</b><b>get retired. That's how you live down here. I was</b><b>like, that seems like a long time, dad. Yeah. So,</b><b>um, and I imagine, I mean, that's a long time to</b><b>live in New York city. Yeah. I feel like I've</b><b>heard a lot of other people tell me that too.</b><b>Like when I asked people that like 10 years, 10</b><b>years, I was there for 10 years. Like, I feel</b><b>like 10 years. Yeah. You're done. You're done. So</b><b>that's just such a grind. Yeah. You wake up and</b><b>it's on and maybe you go hide in your apartment,</b><b>but then you need to go do something and it's on.</b><b>Got to be on. Yeah. It's on. What would you say</b><b>is like one of your best memories from living in</b><b>the city? Um, oh my God.</b><b>Well, before I moved out, I had a great apartment</b><b>and my best friend at the time, her bedroom</b><b>apartment, her apartment was right next to mine.</b><b>So my living room, all the other side was, yeah,</b><b>we both had adjoining balconies. And yeah, so we</b><b>had a lot of fun. Just, you know, at that point</b><b>that was just, I don't know anything particular,</b><b>but we just ran around and, you know, we just had</b><b>a lot of fun. Would you say you had a very Sex</b><b>and the City type experience? Yeah. That's what I</b><b>was thinking about when I just talked about her</b><b>and our next journey we got was like Sex and the</b><b>City, which is, you know, the restaurants and</b><b>then going out and the dirty martinis and like,</b><b>you know, we just did like running around and</b><b>having fun. And that's awesome. You had that</b><b>experience. We were both working, you know, yeah,</b><b>we were both working and doing well and running</b><b>around and having fun. And you could afford it.</b><b>Yeah. We could afford it at that point because we</b><b>had lived with the roommates and the walk-ups and</b><b>the, you know, we did all that stuff. So. Would</b><b>your siblings or your parents ever come in and</b><b>visit you when you live there? Nobody really</b><b>wanted to come in and visit. Um, my, I broke my</b><b>ankle at one point, which was terrible. It was in</b><b>a basketball league in New York. When you're</b><b>still playing sports. I was still playing sports.</b><b>Yeah. Okay. And, um, was it mixed or just women?</b><b>Just women, just women. I went down hard and I</b><b>like crazy, crazy breaking my ankle and I needed</b><b>surgery and everything. So my mom came up and</b><b>like stayed with me for a couple of days because</b><b>I was totally immobile. Um, but other than that,</b><b>like, no, I think once my birthday, they came up</b><b>and we saw a show and like, but during the 10</b><b>years, no, nobody was like, a little bit of a</b><b>hike from Philly. Is there a couple hours of</b><b>getting through the tunnels and bridges and did</b><b>you ever do the Christmas stuff like radio city,</b><b>Rockettes and all that? You know, I know it's so</b><b>funny. I never did that stuff. I had never gone</b><b>to the empire state building. Like you just live</b><b>there. So I did go skating in Rockefeller center</b><b>and see the tree and all that. But I never saw</b><b>records. I never, you never went to the top of</b><b>the Empire State building.</b><b>That's where I'll have to go back and do that.</b><b>It's cool. It's cool. We have, we have a secret.</b><b>We won't share it online, but if you do text,</b><b>yeah, way to cut the line, the top way to cut the</b><b>line. Okay. So you decided to leave the city. So</b><b>what steps did you take to get down to Florida?</b><b>Well, I was just visiting my parents at that</b><b>point. I was still working and it was like, just</b><b>a thought like, okay, I want to do something</b><b>else. I want to live some roles. And then I ended</b><b>up getting engaged and marrying someone who lived</b><b>down here. Okay. Did you meet him in the city? I</b><b>met him in the city. Yeah, we were, we were, we</b><b>have a mutual. We ended up having a mutual friend</b><b>who set up up on a blind date. And so the blind</b><b>date happened in the city. And then, uh, you</b><b>know, eventually we got engaged and I got married</b><b>and came down here. So that worked out because</b><b>you wanted to be down here anyways, right? I</b><b>wanted to be down here. So, okay. So it works.</b><b>Yeah. So when you got down here, did you then</b><b>look for a job? You didn't have a job when you</b><b>came down here, right? So you needed to find one.</b><b>So what did you do? Considering, um, so the</b><b>swimsuit, um, is in Miami, like for the, you</b><b>know, the garment district in Miami, but I</b><b>thought, Oh, that's a long drive. And you know, I</b><b>did that in New York. I don't know if I really</b><b>want to do that. And I've always wanted to be a</b><b>yoga teacher. And now that I'm down here, like,</b><b>you know, I couldn't figure out how to do that in</b><b>New York and afford rent.</b><b>So, um, I, I met someone who was doing yoga down</b><b>here and she was like, Oh, Mary, we're doing a</b><b>teacher training. You should totally do it. And I</b><b>did. So is that something you did in New York</b><b>though? Did you, I went to classes. Yeah. Yeah. I</b><b>took classes. That's where I first like started.</b><b>Wow. I really liked this yoga thing. It's</b><b>awesome. So when did you start yoga? How old were</b><b>you when you first did yoga?</b><b>Oh God. Um, Oh, I don't know. Um, maybe 30.</b><b>Okay. In the city. Okay. Yeah. It started going,</b><b>I was going to Equinox and we take classes there.</b><b>At the gym. Did you keep swimming after college?</b><b>No, I stopped swimming, but you know, when I</b><b>started swimming again, anytime I get injured or</b><b>hurt when I hurt my ankle, I get back in the</b><b>pool. Okay. I hurt something. I get that when I</b><b>was pregnant, I got back in the pool. Like it's</b><b>therapeutic. It's therapeutic. Cause it takes,</b><b>there's no weight. You just, you're not using</b><b>your body weight. So it's very, very gentle and</b><b>I'm happy that I, that I, is that a mind body</b><b>thing for you or more of just the, you know,</b><b>it'll help. I know it'll help. Yeah. I know it'll</b><b>help. And it's like, you know, when I w with my</b><b>ankle, I had to, um, just wanted to get off it,</b><b>it hurt, you know, to get off it. And so the</b><b>swimming and the mobility and when you're in the</b><b>water, all your joints, you're super mobile and</b><b>you're completely supported by the water. So</b><b>it's, it's like the greatest thing if you have</b><b>any type of injury. So then you, did you get</b><b>certified to become a yoga instructor? And I got</b><b>certified. How long does that take?</b><b>That it's a 200 hour to be certified with yoga</b><b>Alliance. So it was the 200 hours of training and</b><b>teaching and watching, observing. And yeah, that</b><b>was fun. And then you started teaching. Yeah. And</b><b>then I started teaching. And did you like it</b><b>right off the bat teaching? Actually, no.</b><b>I didn't. It's so funny. I didn't really like it</b><b>that much because, um, um, I don't know. I think</b><b>like, I guess I just, I wasn't that sure myself</b><b>in the beginning and you know, this is a physical</b><b>practice now. So you're in charge of like</b><b>people's physical safety and, you know, I just,</b><b>so that I got a little nervous with that. But</b><b>then the more I learned about the body and the</b><b>anatomy and the practice and you know, like</b><b>anything, the more you do it, the more you learn.</b><b>And then I ended up loving it. Okay. That's,</b><b>that's great. And I have, I will say I've taken</b><b>some classes from Mary. She's amazing. Yeah.</b><b>You're amazing teacher. Yes. And I didn't know</b><b>anything I was doing and wonderful teacher. So,</b><b>um, so you're married, you're a yoga teacher. And</b><b>then did you, did you start a family? Yeah. So</b><b>then I did, I have a daughter. Okay. Um, and</b><b>that's life changing. That was totally life</b><b>changing. So you come from living almost 10 years</b><b>in the city, living the sex in the city. Very</b><b>independent. Very independent. Totally. You've</b><b>hustled and now you're living a domestic life and</b><b>you're very zen with yoga teaching and you become</b><b>a mother. So how would you describe how that</b><b>changed your life? Becoming a mother. Um, I guess</b><b>it changed everything because for the first time,</b><b>instead of thinking about what do I want to do?</b><b>What do I want to go? What do I want to learn?</b><b>You know, changing from this flip and going from</b><b>this to that, it was, what does she need?</b><b>Yeah. Yeah. And I better learn fast. So I started</b><b>reading books about babies and pregnancies and</b><b>nutrition and all of the things and I slept on my</b><b>left side and I, you know, I did all the things.</b><b>And never stopped, I guess. Yeah, it doesn't.</b><b>Yeah. It never ends. Isn't it amazing though, how</b><b>we immediately, um, come out of ourselves and</b><b>it's all about that child has to be like, it's</b><b>just immediate. Like you're in charge of this</b><b>life. Yes. Don't mess it up. Yes.</b><b>And invariably somewhere along the line, we do</b><b>somehow a little bit, but for sure, you know, but</b><b>it's, it's an instant thing, you know, and</b><b>immediately we're, and that's why I think it's so</b><b>hard, um, for women, especially to balance</b><b>self-care when they become mothers. Oh yeah.</b><b>Because our first instinct is always to give,</b><b>give, give to our children. And, um, that's</b><b>definitely not something that Gen X women were</b><b>taught because of course our mothers and</b><b>grandparents, why can't speak, your mom was</b><b>unusual. No, so maybe she did talk to you about</b><b>this, but in general, our mothers and</b><b>grandparents, grandmothers didn't talk to us</b><b>about self-care, prioritizing that for ourselves,</b><b>even as a mother, finding that time for</b><b>ourselves. And I think that's something that Gen</b><b>X moms are just now finding midlife, really</b><b>carving that time out for ourselves, honoring</b><b>ourselves and, um, giving that self-care time to</b><b>ourselves. Because when we became mothers, we</b><b>immediately were like, it's all about you. Yeah.</b><b>Just give it all over. I remember when I first</b><b>heard that free self-care, I was like, this is</b><b>stupid. I'm like, what is that? Like go to sleep,</b><b>eat, just be alive. Like I didn't, I didn't even</b><b>understand what it actually meant and, um, and</b><b>how important it really is. Well, for a lot of</b><b>people, yoga self-care. Oh, for sure. Oh my God.</b><b>It's my self-care. Yeah. Yeah. So, all right. So</b><b>you're humming along. You have your daughter. I'm</b><b>going to love, I'm going to long. And, um, did</b><b>you do, in addition to teaching yoga, did you,</b><b>because you seem to be very adventurous and, um,</b><b>even though you might have a little bit of</b><b>imposter syndrome at times, it doesn't stop you</b><b>from tackling new experiences. Um, so was there</b><b>anything else you did along the lines while you</b><b>were raising your daughter and teaching yoga?</b><b>Yeah. So while I was teaching yoga, um, this is</b><b>around 2013 when yoga really started to become</b><b>like big, big time, um, as far as even a fashion</b><b>movement, right? Like jeans used to be the comfy</b><b>clothes and now where everyone's in leggings.</b><b>Yeah. And anyway, I just remember like going to</b><b>these yoga classes and seeing these really</b><b>terrible prints, just the kind of reminded me of</b><b>the prints that I'd see like in cars in Europe,</b><b>you know, how like, yeah, like that, that, that</b><b>cloth on the inside, it's like these like neon</b><b>triangles and squares and it's just so ugly. Yes.</b><b>Or it makes me think of jazzercise. Like</b><b>jazzercise patterns. It's like this really ugly</b><b>prints and patterns that you have computer</b><b>generated and they're on Nike and all these great</b><b>brands. And I'm like, there's gotta be something</b><b>better out there. So I ended up taking a class at</b><b>the art school down the street and, um, it was a</b><b>fashion design class and basically like learned</b><b>how to do, um, the computer for these prints,</b><b>like graphic design, pretty much, I guess you'd</b><b>call it graphic design. I don't even, and anyway,</b><b>I took this class and then I got some</b><b>manufacturer to like, got some fabrics and then I</b><b>started, all right, let's see what my print looks</b><b>like on the fabric. And I had known all about fit</b><b>through my time in York and working in the</b><b>garment district. So I was like, okay, I gotta</b><b>find the right fit and something that's not</b><b>see-through. I mean, you've seen all kinds of</b><b>things in the yoga studio. You don't want to be</b><b>seeing. And so any, any way long story short is I</b><b>ended up creating, um, a leggings line. That's</b><b>amazing. How do you even, like you said, you got</b><b>a manufacturer and you got the fact, okay. So how</b><b>do you get a manufacturer? Yeah. That just sounds</b><b>like you just pick up and call a manufacturer.</b><b>Yellow pages. Yeah, I know. I mean, and then, so</b><b>how does, how do you even do that? So the woman I</b><b>took the class from, she had a couple of</b><b>connections and I, I was trying to trial and</b><b>error. I had to call someone and they ended up</b><b>making some samples for me that were so bad, like</b><b>I could have sewn these samples and I don't even</b><b>know how to sew. They were really bad. And then,</b><b>um, she finally hooked me up with somebody who</b><b>does this on a large scale, lots of brands. Okay.</b><b>And, um, so, and then the, and then the same</b><b>thing with the fabric, like I just looked up like</b><b>Google, it's like who, I think I looked up like,</b><b>who does Lululemon get their fabric from? Where</b><b>are these? You know, and I found a place in</b><b>California, which I liked in the USA. And I asked</b><b>for some of their samples and then just trial and</b><b>error, just what fabric weights and stretchiness</b><b>that you like. And, um, they just went from</b><b>there. And so then you started your line, started</b><b>my line. It was called man maker, man maker, man</b><b>maker sports. I just went on like zoom legal</b><b>zoom, I think, and got an LLC. I'm like, I called</b><b>my brother. He's a lawyer. I'm like, do I need to</b><b>know? What do I do? Like, how does one start a</b><b>business? I didn't know like an LC and I did some</b><b>paintings, some drawings, some whatever. And I</b><b>created some cool designs and put them on the</b><b>pants. And I got a website domain on, you know,</b><b>you can do these things. Yeah. Oh no, you know</b><b>what? I went to Shopify because I was selling</b><b>stuff and I just like figured that out. It's, I</b><b>mean, it's not hard to figure that stuff out. If</b><b>I can figure it out, anyone can figure it out.</b><b>Cause I'm not techie. Sorry. You, you must be</b><b>artistically inclined though. I mean, yeah. I</b><b>mean, to come up with these designs, I mean, and</b><b>also you worked in fashion that had to have been</b><b>something that came naturally to you. Yeah. I</b><b>think that I've always enjoyed aesthetically that</b><b>kind of thing and always loved fashion, but I</b><b>didn't know. And I just did it. I just did it.</b><b>I'm like, let's just see how it turns out. If it</b><b>turns out bad, it's bad. But some things came out</b><b>really, really nice that I was really proud of.</b><b>And so, um, just ended up going for it. And then</b><b>where did you sell your, your, uh, attire? Cause</b><b>it wasn't just leggings, right? You had, um,</b><b>yeah, I know I had, um, bra sports bras. And I</b><b>ended up doing a top and I ended up doing a</b><b>dress. I just basically did</b><b>stuff that I wanted to wear.</b><b>And, um, it was just again, another hustle. Like</b><b>I would go to trunk shows, like outside yoga</b><b>studios at events around town, just hustling and</b><b>filling up back in my car with racks and all</b><b>these clothes and put them in garbage bags and</b><b>hang them up and get a table and get some</b><b>marketing stuff and it, wow, it was fun. It was a</b><b>lot. Um, I did that. And then in the end I ended</b><b>up getting in a couple of yoga studios, which was</b><b>very, very cool and a lot better than all that</b><b>hustle, hustle, hustle. But then COVID happened</b><b>and, um, and everything kind of shut down a</b><b>little bit. And then two years must've gone by</b><b>because then I was over that.</b><b>We're seeing a pattern here. Maybe I am a little</b><b>lady. I can't do anything for too long. Well, and</b><b>I, and again, I can attest, I, um, own a few</b><b>pairs of leggings and I still wear them. I wear</b><b>your sports bras are super comfortable. You're</b><b>not doing that. Any of that anymore. Right. But I</b><b>mean, how exciting that you did that. Yeah. You</b><b>know, maybe I'll go back to it. It's very cool.</b><b>Not now. It was really, really fun. Very cool.</b><b>And super high quality compared to pretty much</b><b>everything else that was out there. Super high</b><b>quality. I think we learned our lesson from COVID</b><b>in Florida, so you could probably, probably safe</b><b>to go back in. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Well</b><b>speaking. Okay. So our, our COVID experience in</b><b>Florida, I would say is very different than the</b><b>rest of the world, like we, we were shut down</b><b>maybe what? Two months. We were lucky. We were</b><b>very lucky. There were still some places that</b><b>still, you still to wear a mask, I think in the</b><b>grocery stores. Right. No. Wait now. No, no.</b><b>After two months, I think we still had to wear.</b><b>We did. I think we did. Right. I think. No, no,</b><b>no. It was suggested. I remember being in publics</b><b>and being like the only person without a mask</b><b>because it was suggested, but not required. I</b><b>thought even though serious hate on that</b><b>statement. Yeah. But even though we, um, even</b><b>though we opened after two months, I thought we</b><b>still had to wear masks everywhere. Maybe the</b><b>kids, right? The school's got right crazy and</b><b>stuff, but I don't know. I don't know. Do you</b><b>remember wearing masks in grocery stores and</b><b>stuff? I remember taking off my mask in grocery</b><b>stores and people being like, they would chase</b><b>you. Um, no, I never got chased, but, um, what</b><b>happened? Oh, I know what happened. I didn't want</b><b>to wear my mask. And so they took my temperature</b><b>fair enough. So it was like, that's great at the</b><b>store. Yeah. Yeah. I remember going to the whole</b><b>food and they were like, ma'am, can you put on</b><b>your mask? And I was like, Oh, I don't wear</b><b>masks. Sorry. And they were like, okay, can we</b><b>take your temperature? I said, yeah, you totally</b><b>take my temperature. So they did that. And that</b><b>was up. That's how pretty much everyone should</b><b>have done it on the country. Now that you say</b><b>that we went to a lacrosse tournament up in</b><b>Orlando. And in order to get in, they had,</b><b>remember that they would take your temperature at</b><b>the gate. As long as you weren't, you know, you</b><b>never fever, you were fine. That's right. I</b><b>totally forgot about that approach.</b><b>Even when we, um, we're traveling in the South</b><b>the summer of 2020. It was pretty lax. I think</b><b>this, I think overall, that's when Dylan was</b><b>playing lacrosse and we were playing lacrosse up</b><b>in South Carolina. Very similar experience. It</b><b>was over. Yeah. I think we had to wear maybe your</b><b>mask to the table or something to the need, which</b><b>made no sense. They took it off. Yeah. But, but I</b><b>think we were very fortunate to where we lived in</b><b>Florida. We definitely had a better experience</b><b>than Northern friends. Absolutely. Absolutely.</b><b>Okay. So after, um, so COVID hits, so you're not</b><b>doing man-maker sports anymore. Were you still</b><b>teaching yoga? Cause I know the yoga studio shut</b><b>down, right? They did. We were doing it online.</b><b>That's right. Yeah. It was in my backyard. That's</b><b>right. And then, um, and then things kind of get</b><b>back to normal. Was there another, any other</b><b>major changes that happened in your life? After</b><b>2020. Yeah. So, um, like, uh, are you talking</b><b>about? Personally? Oh, personally.</b><b>Well, yeah. So I, after COVID, yeah, I was just</b><b>started teaching yoga again. And then I, I guess</b><b>the most, the biggest life event after that was I</b><b>got divorced. You got divorced.</b><b>Yeah. So how long were you married?</b><b>15 years. That's a long time. Yeah.</b><b>Um, so you are divorced now, right? And you are</b><b>starting really freshly starting your new life.</b><b>Right. Yeah. How has that been?</b><b>Good. Yeah. It's been great. Clearly I like</b><b>change. So this, yeah, it wasn't two years. It</b><b>was 15. Yeah, that was 15. Exactly. Exactly. Now</b><b>this is a big, huge change. Um, and you're a</b><b>single mom. Yeah. It's been a single mom. So, um,</b><b>for women out there that are maybe going through</b><b>a divorce or freshly divorced, um, what advice</b><b>would you give? Cause you literally just went</b><b>through it. Yeah. I think I would say to anybody,</b><b>um, thinking about getting divorced or my advice</b><b>would be look into a collaborative lawyer. So</b><b>collaborative lawyers, and you don't know this</b><b>until you go through it, but collaborative</b><b>lawyers are, we'll save you a ton of time and</b><b>money, which I did not have that option so much.</b><b>I didn't, ours was not collaborative in this, in</b><b>a sense that our lawyers were, um, litigators. So</b><b>it's either like you have a litigating lawyer,</b><b>which is basically a fighting lawyer, or you have</b><b>a collaborative lawyer, which works kind of for</b><b>the two of you together, and it's like, if you</b><b>are on speaking terms, I think that you should at</b><b>least look up Google if you're, anyone's out</b><b>there thinking about doing this collaborative</b><b>lawyer. Um, so it's just kind of can dismantle</b><b>your marriage in a more collaborative way that's</b><b>less adversarial and fighting and lengthy. These</b><b>things go on forever. And which of course is just</b><b>a million dollar signs. It's terrible for the</b><b>lawyers. Yeah. They make out right. They're,</b><b>yeah, you're losing. Yeah. Everybody else. And</b><b>it's like your life. It's your life. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>It's like, why are you getting rich off of? It's</b><b>big business. Yeah. It's big business. So that,</b><b>that would be my biggest advice. I've never heard</b><b>of a collaborative lawyer. I'm throwing it out</b><b>there because I, you don't, nobody really talks</b><b>about it. You heard these long divorces. They</b><b>take two years, three years, four years, people</b><b>spending, gajillion dollars. It's like, just get</b><b>a collaborative, talk to your spouse, get a</b><b>collaborative lawyer and be like, Hey, listen,</b><b>let's try to do this like that. That would be my</b><b>advice. Is that like one attorney who's acting on</b><b>both of your rehabs to mediate a conversation and</b><b>a settlement, rather than you pay your team, the</b><b>other person pays their team. It's one person</b><b>trying to help you sort it out. Or I don't know</b><b>if you each get a collaborative lawyer or if it's</b><b>one lawyer. I kind of think it's one that goes</b><b>between the two of you and just is like the</b><b>mediator type of person that's like, all right.</b><b>And they try to, and you have to do that in the</b><b>end anyway. You have to kind of figure, unless</b><b>you're going to go to court and then let some</b><b>judge figure it out for you. But you kind of get</b><b>there eventually anyway. So it's kind of like</b><b>cutting to the chase. Like we're going to end up</b><b>splitting whatever it is we're splitting and</b><b>deciding on whatever we decide. Let's talk it</b><b>over now with this person. So yeah, people</b><b>haven't heard of collaborative. No, no. It almost</b><b>reminds me of, um, the concept of a mediator, but</b><b>as a lawyer, exactly what it is, which sounds</b><b>perfect. It's like skipping to the end and just</b><b>having that person do you see a lot of money and</b><b>a lot of time. That's my advice. That's great</b><b>advice. That is great advice. Um, cause it's,</b><b>it's so stressful anyways, then to be throwing so</b><b>much money at lawyers is, is</b><b>so you, um, have your, is it your own place now</b><b>for the first time in 15 years? How's that?</b><b>It's good. I mean, I'm still just pretty much</b><b>unpacking. There's boxes everywhere. There's</b><b>painters everywhere. So it's, um, it's, it's</b><b>awesome. It's great. I mean, it's a, it's a new</b><b>beginning. It's a new start. It's so it's</b><b>exciting. And it's your own place. It's my own</b><b>place. It's your own dishes and your own</b><b>everything. Everything is you're picking it out.</b><b>And yeah, that's that. I'm, I'm really happy for</b><b>you that, um, that you found a place that you can</b><b>call home and feel comfortable and you, you know,</b><b>for you and for your daughter and your dog, so</b><b>that's awesome. So what, so then, um, during the</b><b>divorce also, um, wasn't there some loss? You</b><b>went through a lot in a short period of time.</b><b>Yeah. And, um, um, right before it, I lost my</b><b>dad. And so that was very, very, very difficult.</b><b>What did he pass away from?</b><b>It was, he went to the dentist and he wasn't</b><b>feeling well after that. And so I think he got</b><b>sick. He got a virus. He got sick and just that</b><b>generation, what generation is that 1937? I mean,</b><b>that's silent. Well, yeah. So it's like, they</b><b>could be a breath from death. I'm okay. I don't</b><b>want to see a doctor. I'm fine. And it was kind</b><b>of like that. And I think by the time we finally</b><b>acted, um, it was, it was pretty far gone and it</b><b>was just like, we were just like backpedaling and</b><b>trying to, how old was he trying to save his</b><b>life? Um, my dad died at 84, 85. I forget. He</b><b>died in 2023, right after his birthday. He's he's</b><b>the end of the year birthday. Um, yeah. So that,</b><b>that was terrible. And then right after that,</b><b>then the divorce started and that thing took a</b><b>year and a half, two years, and that just came</b><b>out of that now. And, um, it's kind of starting</b><b>again, back to back traumas in a way. Yeah. So it</b><b>is a lot. Yeah. It's funny cause your dad also</b><b>same generation. Um, wasn't feeling well, not</b><b>really not communicating it to many people, maybe</b><b>your mom and come to find out, you know, he had</b><b>cancer and I think he</b><b>passed away seven weeks later.</b><b>I think it's, I think it's something with that</b><b>generation, the men, like not talking about their</b><b>health and the women too. My mom was the same</b><b>way. Did you lose your mom? 2021. Okay. That's</b><b>what I thought. So, and what did you lose your</b><b>mom from? I think just old age, but she, she, my</b><b>mom would not take any medication. And, um, you</b><b>know, she had high blood pressure or she had, um,</b><b>heart disease and she just, you know, lived her</b><b>life and did her thing. And eventually she just</b><b>kind of. How come she</b><b>wouldn't take any medication? It out.</b><b>She just, she, after my mom died, we found like</b><b>all this, these. You know, notebooks and things.</b><b>And she, this quote from, I think, I don't know,</b><b>Ben Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, somebody saying</b><b>like the, the, the best medicine is nutrition and</b><b>food. And she believed in all that, which I also</b><b>do, but she, um, didn't have the lifestyles to</b><b>support that completely. You know, she was an out</b><b>like going to her yoga class or whatever she, you</b><b>know, and she was homeless kids real life. But so</b><b>she just didn't want to take medication and she</b><b>did. And I'm not saying taking it would have</b><b>prolonged her life or not, but, um, the side</b><b>effects and the this and the that, you know, she</b><b>just didn't want any of that. She just didn't</b><b>want any of that. And she</b><b>just lived her life her way.</b><b>So, and then she held with she, when she passed</b><b>away 83. Okay. So they were both in like a pretty</b><b>good life though. Yeah. She was 83 now that I</b><b>know my dad was 85. Yeah. That's pretty good.</b><b>Nowadays, even your mid eighties is still kind of</b><b>young. Like people are living longer. I know. If</b><b>you think like when we were younger, I think</b><b>about 80, but there's still, you know, it's not</b><b>how it used to be. Like sixties are like the</b><b>forties. I feel like of the fifties. I agree.</b><b>Yeah, I know. 100%. So you lost your mom and then</b><b>you lost your dad and then you go through this.</b><b>Crazy. Yeah. So you really are coming. I feel out</b><b>of this into this new chapter of your life. Um,</b><b>you have your new, your place, your space. Um,</b><b>what about professionally? Cause you, are you</b><b>teaching yoga still? I'm still teaching yoga.</b><b>Okay. Um, and, um, I, when this whole thing</b><b>started, the divorce, I mean, I, um, did I go see</b><b>a, I went to, I went to go see a channeler. Okay.</b><b>So, and she, I walked in there. Now she's not a</b><b>channeler. She's a. Like a medium. No, what's the</b><b>word she's, um, Oh, what's the word Nicole? And</b><b>she, um, not a psychic, I guess it's type of</b><b>psychic, but it's like, um, trying to think like</b><b>me. Um, I'm thinking of like a Ouija board.</b><b>No, not that I forget. I forget. I think it was</b><b>like in the realm of Reiki, which is like energy,</b><b>which is why I was drawn to this and so I went,</b><b>but she, but she turned out to be like kind of</b><b>like psychic and things anyway, long story short,</b><b>as I walked in there and she was like, yes, yes,</b><b>they're telling me at some like, who, you know,</b><b>and she's just like, wherever I was talking to</b><b>her and she's like, what is it you really want to</b><b>do, you know, and I'm like, well, I'm really now</b><b>I know I'm getting divorced. I'm like, you know,</b><b>I'm teaching yoga, but maybe I want to do</b><b>something else or something more into this. And,</b><b>um, she was like, have you ever heard of tapping?</b><b>And I said, yeah, I've heard of it, but I don't</b><b>really know exactly what it is. And she, and so</b><b>then she's like, I think whatever that turned</b><b>into me getting curious about what is tapping,</b><b>which is EFT, which is,</b><b>um, what is EFT stand for?</b><b>It's emotional freedom techniques. Emotional</b><b>freedom techniques. Yeah.</b><b>You, um, you speak like what is on your mind.</b><b>What's happening with her. It's an anxiety, a</b><b>stress of fear, something that happened in the</b><b>past and it's happening in the future or</b><b>something you're worried about now. Sadness,</b><b>whatever you're, you're speaking the words as</b><b>you're tapping. So, um, you are processing the</b><b>whatever trauma, the worry, the fear, the stress</b><b>physically and emotionally. So it's kind of like</b><b>re I'm sorry. Is it kind of like rewiring? Yes.</b><b>Yeah. It's like rewiring. So it's like, you're</b><b>not changing the experience you had. You're</b><b>changing your perception of the experience.</b><b>You're not storing it as, as, as, as a trauma or</b><b>as a trigger stress. It's another way of</b><b>unpacking trauma. It's another way of unpacking</b><b>trauma. So not just psychologically, but</b><b>physiologically. Yeah. Cause it's the tapping and</b><b>the talking together. Right. So we're taught that</b><b>trauma comes to the body, enters physically. And</b><b>so it has to leave physically. Because the body</b><b>never forgets. It holds on to trauma, right?</b><b>Right. Right. Until you do. And I always say, if</b><b>you don't deal with something in your mind, your</b><b>body's still going to deal with that. A thousand</b><b>percent. Your sickness, through what something is</b><b>going to happen. Yeah. So it's almost releasing</b><b>that. Yes. Physically. Yes. But also</b><b>psychologically at the same time. So it's like</b><b>therapy. Yes. It is like, it's like literally</b><b>like it is like, it is therapy. Pretty much. I</b><b>mean, I think we're technically not allowed to</b><b>think I wouldn't, so I got certified in this.</b><b>Right. Right. Um, so you're not able to say</b><b>you're a therapist. I'm not a psychologist or</b><b>anything like that. I am certified in EFT tapping</b><b>and, um, um, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's,</b><b>it's amazing. I mean, it's, it's so amazing. And</b><b>then what's cool about it is when you're the</b><b>practitioner, all you're doing is asking,</b><b>listening and asking questions and it's all, it</b><b>all comes from within the client, the patient,</b><b>the person, you know, and it's so cool. Cause as</b><b>you're tapping and talking, you might be talking</b><b>about this fear you have of speaking in front of</b><b>large groups because you have to do this for your</b><b>work, so we're tapping through it. And then all</b><b>of a sudden you, you're like, wow, this is crazy.</b><b>I'm thinking about that time in fifth grade</b><b>where, you know, I was made fun of because I had</b><b>on like these bad genes or whatever, and then,</b><b>and then it turns into that and, and you kind of.</b><b>It's like, wow, what happened? And well, that was</b><b>the day that we all went to the auditorium and</b><b>you find out like why you have this fear of</b><b>talking in front of people. And if you can kind</b><b>of get in there and just kind of smooth out that</b><b>memory, it lightens your load then for a talk</b><b>trip. Yeah, it's very trippy. It's, it's amazing.</b><b>Cause all that stuff is stored in your memory and</b><b>in your body. When you do that, then are you, say</b><b>you're, you and I are doing this. Are you tap me</b><b>or am I tapping myself and you're talking and</b><b>facilitating? You're following my lead. So I'll</b><b>be okay. Tap on the side of your hand and I'll</b><b>say something and you'll repeat it, but it's be</b><b>your words, like you'll tell me what's going on.</b><b>Like if you're like, um, for, we'll just use the</b><b>fear of talking in front of people, you could</b><b>say, Oh my gosh, I have, I'm, I have to give a</b><b>presentation tomorrow in front of a thousand</b><b>people. And I am anxious and nervous. And I'd</b><b>say, where do you feel it in your body? Brian,</b><b>you'd be like, I feel it in my gut. I'm like,</b><b>okay. So you'd be like, even though I feel</b><b>anxious and nervous and I feel it in my gut,</b><b>cause I have to talk tomorrow in front of a</b><b>thousand people. And then you have an end or</b><b>where that's the positive part. I still deeply</b><b>and completely accept myself or ice. I still know</b><b>I can get through it and I'll do it well or</b><b>whatever the end you want to say is, and then</b><b>I'll say, okay, top of the head feeling anxious</b><b>in my stomach, and then you'll be like anxious in</b><b>my stomach. So I'm doing it and you're mirroring</b><b>me. Okay. So you're doing it. I'm looking at you</b><b>and I'm, I'm tapping me</b><b>and you're tapping you. Okay.</b><b>Which also is a good question because some people</b><b>ask like, wow, how do you do this? Like, you</b><b>know, people can go through heavy things and get</b><b>through it and not be exhausted or take it on and</b><b>you're not taking it on cause you're doing the</b><b>tapping too. So you're keeping yourself.</b><b>Then, and, um, is the tapping then sort of a</b><b>distraction or you, or maybe the outlet, right?</b><b>It's if I'm tapping and I'm thinking of this,</b><b>you, maybe you start off with this negative thing</b><b>that's causing you anxiety, and then you switch</b><b>to more positive thoughts or, or just dig into it</b><b>a little bit. And as you're tapping, is that a</b><b>way to like kind of get it out? That's the outlet</b><b>releasing the concept. Totally. So you're</b><b>starting to top at the center of your head, which</b><b>is your amygdala. And that's where your whole,</b><b>your memories, your bad memories or your trauma</b><b>or whatever. So it's, it's starting these, every</b><b>part has a different, um, energetic, like opening</b><b>in the body. So you're tapping on very specific</b><b>spots, but also why you're tapping. Yes. Cause</b><b>you have to think about what to say. You're</b><b>physically moving. So you're using left brain and</b><b>right brain. So it does distract you a little</b><b>bit. And then, yeah, so that's a great question</b><b>and that it's all part of it and why it works</b><b>together. So are you working with people doing</b><b>that actively? Yeah. And have you seen, you've</b><b>helped people get something, I don't know, off</b><b>their chest, out of their body</b><b>type of thing, off their mind.</b><b>Unpack their trauma. Unpacking. Unpackaging is</b><b>what it really is. Or as he calls it,</b><b>unpackaging. He always gets her wrong. He says</b><b>unpackaging, not unpackaging. I'm coining that.</b><b>But then, um, put it on the shirt. Yeah.</b><b>But then, um, so let's say the next day they go</b><b>to give their speech and I don't know if you just</b><b>touched on this, but can they then tap at that</b><b>same spot to re-calm themselves? Mm-hmm. Oh yeah,</b><b>for sure. Um, one of the sneaky ways you can do</b><b>it is on your fingertips. You can just kind of</b><b>squeeze the side of your fingertips and nobody</b><b>sees like one and then the other just to kind of</b><b>calm yourself down. It's almost like pressure</b><b>points. I don't think. Now does it go below the</b><b>neck? The tapping? Yeah. So it starts top of the</b><b>head here and then you'll go side of the eye,</b><b>under the eye here, here, and then right around</b><b>collarbone area. And then the last area is like</b><b>four inches below the armpit here. Okay. And it</b><b>starts at the side of the hand. Now, um, I know a</b><b>lot of people also carry trauma in their hips,</b><b>but does tapping not do you, so you stay, you</b><b>stay up here. Physically with the tapping, we</b><b>stay up there, but we can tap on physical pain</b><b>anywhere. Okay. All right. When I say on it, I</b><b>mean, acknowledge it, like, even though I have</b><b>this searing pain in my hip and it started last</b><b>week and I feel anxious about it, you know, I</b><b>deeply and completely upset myself. Like we can</b><b>go through it and then your pain can start.</b><b>Sometimes it's, there is a technique called</b><b>chasing the pain or now they call it chasing the</b><b>sensation. It can start to move and you're like,</b><b>you know, my hip feels okay, but now my knee</b><b>hurts, my knee is okay, but now my shoulder's</b><b>feeling it and you're chasing it because your</b><b>body's like sending it places. You're moving</b><b>energy. And also people start to yawn far. Like</b><b>things happen. Yeah. Yeah. What a trip. Yeah.</b><b>Energy starts to move. Involuntary responses in</b><b>some ways. What a trip. Yeah. Do you have people</b><b>that come for regular sessions like repeatedly or</b><b>is it mainly? Not as much now I need to, I'm</b><b>trying to cultivate my business in this. So what</b><b>I'm doing mostly is teaching yoga, but I've had</b><b>some zooms like, and I have to get my website out</b><b>there, you know, I have been in like marketing.</b><b>Well, you've been busy. Come on. What are you</b><b>doing? You got to get it together. It's been</b><b>getting divorced and starting your new chapter.</b><b>It takes a lot. You're really, you're really</b><b>there now, like at the edge of that. So are you,</b><b>um, are you just doing the tapping and the</b><b>yogurts or any, it feels like there's a lot of</b><b>things, it's a spider web of, of related things</b><b>that could go with that. I have</b><b>one more, um, pan on the stove.</b><b>It's a homeopathy. So I'm a student of homeopathy</b><b>right now, which is an energy medicine, really.</b><b>And, um, uh, it's a two year program that I'm in</b><b>and, uh, I'm, June will be one year into it, but</b><b>it'll be halfway. Wow. Yeah. And then next year,</b><b>hopefully I'll be a registered homeopath of North</b><b>America. So is that like a doctor of homeopathic</b><b>medicine? Not a doctor, just certified to with</b><b>homeopathic homeopathic medicine. So that whole</b><b>thing I think is really related to the tapping</b><b>and the energy, the emotional freedom techniques.</b><b>Um, because the emotional freedom techniques, the</b><b>tapping that's your moving energy, you're</b><b>speaking and with homeopathy, you're taking these</b><b>little pellets that hold the energy, the</b><b>frequency of whatever it's comes from, you know,</b><b>whether it's a flower or a mineral or whatever,</b><b>that's, it's the energy from that substance</b><b>that's been potentized and put into this little</b><b>teeny tiny pill that if you look at under a</b><b>microscope, you're going to see basically</b><b>nothing, but it holds the frequency.</b><b>It's talk about trippy. It's crazy. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>And then you take the pill. You take it, you let</b><b>it, um, just melt underneath your tongue and your</b><b>body just kind of absorbs it and it just assists</b><b>the body. So the whole, the whole concept is</b><b>behind homeopathy, homo is same. So like cures,</b><b>like, so say you have a fever and a headache on</b><b>the left side of your head and you have, you</b><b>know, a rash on your feet will find you a remedy</b><b>that if you took it causes a rash on the feet,</b><b>headache on the left side of your eye and a</b><b>fever. So, so like negates kind of it meets your</b><b>body where your, so your body's responding to</b><b>something. So your body doesn't mess up. Your</b><b>body's like trying to help you. Right. Right. So</b><b>great examples of fever. When you start to get a</b><b>fever, your body's not hurting you. Your body's</b><b>trying to get rid of that pathogen that that is</b><b>hurting you. Yeah. And that's how it gets rid of</b><b>it. So it makes that pathogen uncomfortable by</b><b>raising the body temperature. So when you take a</b><b>remedy, the remedy that's very specific to</b><b>exactly what's going on, and there's a million</b><b>different kinds of temperatures, maybe you're</b><b>better with hot water with cold lying down,</b><b>standing up, there's all these specifications,</b><b>but the bottom line is you take the remedy that</b><b>that's best fits you at that moment and it might</b><b>raise your, your temperature a little bit, but</b><b>it's actually assisting your body. And then the</b><b>temperature will be gone rather than suppressing</b><b>it. Right. With Advil or Tylenol or whatever,</b><b>even though that feels better, your temperature</b><b>will come back. And you're not talking about just</b><b>one pill that is the cure-all. It's addressing</b><b>specific issues. Yeah. Super specific. So when I,</b><b>I used to get vertigo really bad, like I'd have</b><b>these drop attacks, we'd be sitting and soon the</b><b>whole room's spinning and the solution, the best</b><b>solution I found was a homeopathic, I think it</b><b>was called like Composetum something. Costicum.</b><b>Yeah, maybe. And I would put it under my tongue</b><b>was sublingual type of thing. And that thing was</b><b>the best. Yeah. It's a trip. So you're onto</b><b>something. I'm a huge believer in that. Was that</b><b>herbally based? Was that from an herb? What you</b><b>took? No clue. I just, some are herbs, some are</b><b>from poisonous substances. Yeah. Yeah. You know,</b><b>it's, it's all from natural earth, earth, some</b><b>are from earth. You know, who's into this very</b><b>much is Pat. Yeah. We're going to have him on.</b><b>We're going to have a friend of ours is, is, um,</b><b>very well versed in this. He had like Lyme</b><b>disease, nearly died from a few different things.</b><b>And he found, he made it back. He's a doctor of</b><b>naturopath. Yeah. He's a doctor. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>Naturopath out in Oregon.</b><b>Um, so you're getting trained in that. Yeah. So</b><b>then will it be like, once you're done with your</b><b>certification, you will, you can prescribe people</b><b>these, but it's all over the counter. I think,</b><b>right. It's not. It's all over the counter. Like</b><b>right now I can, I can, as a student, I can take,</b><b>um, cases, you know, and charge a little mini</b><b>student rate because I'm being overseen by a</b><b>naturopathic doctor who's training us in a group</b><b>of 12 people in this class. And it's amazing. Dr.</b><b>Eli camp. She's amazing. And she's got a lot of</b><b>cool books out. You can read too. Um, her name's</b><b>Dr. Eat, Eli, Elizabeth camp, Elizabeth camp. And</b><b>is, are these on like zoom virtual? It's a zoom</b><b>every week. Yeah. We take cases and then we</b><b>discuss the cases and then come up with the</b><b>remedies. And that's cool. It's really fun. Yeah.</b><b>That's cool. That's really, really, every day</b><b>will be different. You'll be dealing with</b><b>different ailments. And I bet, are you finding so</b><b>far that the folks you're talking to have tried</b><b>to go the traditional medicinal route and it's</b><b>not working and now it's like, I want to try</b><b>something different. A lot of times that happens.</b><b>Yeah. Where they've tried so many different</b><b>things and then they're like, I'll try anything.</b><b>I'll try this homeopathy thing. You know, and</b><b>some people are just wanting to do something more</b><b>natural in the first place. So it's like a mix,</b><b>but you know, it's interesting with these cases</b><b>that we're taking, um, that I'm getting to listen</b><b>to. It's like, I'll give an example of, you know,</b><b>someone will come in with vertigo and, and</b><b>tinnitus and a skin fungus and athletes foot. And</b><b>then we're like, okay, so I'm thinking, all</b><b>right, what's the worst thing for you? Is it the</b><b>athletes foot? Is it the tinnitus? Like what's</b><b>driving you crazy? And you take their case and</b><b>either they taught, they're taking their case can</b><b>take like two hours. And it's not just tell me</b><b>about your, your, your skin fungus or your</b><b>tinnitus. Tell me about your marriage. Tell me</b><b>about your childhood. Tell me about that or</b><b>whatever they want to talk about. Cause it comes</b><b>forth. And then what's blowing my mind is as</b><b>we're taking these cases, we prescribe on the</b><b>main thing, what's the main thing of the case.</b><b>And sometimes the main thing is not the skin</b><b>fungus or the tinnitus or the vertigo. The main</b><b>thing is shame that your dad was in jail when you</b><b>were a kid. That's what we're prescribing. What a</b><b>trip. Interesting. So there's, you're not, you</b><b>know, it's not like here, take some dandelion</b><b>root for that, right? There's got to dig a little</b><b>deeper. What do you do in that situation when you</b><b>realize that psychological you prescribe for</b><b>that? That's what you prescribe. And, and you</b><b>may, how do you prescribe for</b><b>that? That's a psychological,</b><b>really for shame. So that's, well, yeah, I mean,</b><b>and how you deal with shame, like you might deal</b><b>with shame differently than Nicole deals with</b><b>shame. Like you might, I have no shame.</b><b>You might deny it. Yeah.</b><b>She might like throw something against the wall,</b><b>right? You know, someone else might like go into</b><b>like rages, you know, um, or, or whatever. So</b><b>everybody deals with it differently. And then</b><b>that's what that, and it's, it's so specific. You</b><b>ask all these questions. It's not, it's not, oh,</b><b>you have a headache and you have this, you would</b><b>give you that or, oh, you have shame. Wow. No,</b><b>no, no, no. It gets. So psychological and again,</b><b>and physiological. So it ties in with the tapping</b><b>too. So it can be a whole thing. Like when you</b><b>meet with someone, it can be a holistic medicine.</b><b>Wow. So are you studying anything else that, I</b><b>mean, this feels like it keeps growing and</b><b>growing. Is there, are there any other new things</b><b>you're studying related to this?</b><b>Well, for the, for the, or</b><b>in this world, two years.</b><b>I'm back in tears. Right. It'll be some other, I</b><b>just feel like it can snowball. Yeah. No, it</b><b>does. It does. And I, I guess I'm so excited</b><b>about it now. Cause it's like, they're, they're</b><b>all related that the yoga, the tapping, the</b><b>homeopathy, um, and didn't you go out to, um, was</b><b>it like Tahoe or Palm Springs? Desert in</b><b>California. And I thought you were studying</b><b>something else kind of related in this world.</b><b>It's called matrix re-imprinting. Okay. And I did</b><b>it through Craig Weiner and Alina Frank there, or</b><b>there are my mentors and teachers for the EFT</b><b>tapping. They're amazing. And they, um, Matrix</b><b>re-imprinting is part of the tapping thing. It's</b><b>like a leg of it, but you go into your past life</b><b>or not your past life. You go into your younger</b><b>self maybe. So, uh, and that's, it's, it's very</b><b>wild and it's really cool. And that you do. And</b><b>that actually Brian, when you said before, like,</b><b>is the tapping kind of take your mind off things</b><b>when you're going into make into the matrix. So</b><b>it's called like the matrix because anything can</b><b>happen. It's it's, there's no time space or</b><b>reality. It's kind of you when you were 10 years</b><b>old and you got in this fight with your dad and</b><b>then you didn't see him out, like whatever the</b><b>memory was for you that you have to go back to</b><b>your, while you're doing it, you're tapping just</b><b>on the fingertips and that kind of puts you in a</b><b>little bit of a hypnotic kind of ish head space.</b><b>So you can see yourself as that 10 year old. And</b><b>then you start talking to that 10 year old as a</b><b>completely different entity than you.</b><b>And you have to listen, like what is 10 year old</b><b>Nicole saying? What does she need in that moment</b><b>that she's scared and this is happening to her or</b><b>she's watching something happening, you know,</b><b>cause you're holding that trauma from when you</b><b>were a 10 in your body. Yes. Okay. So now, so</b><b>that through the tapping, you can go back and</b><b>talk about how you feel about it now, but through</b><b>matrix re-imprinting, you actually go back in</b><b>your mind to 10 year old Nicole and you now</b><b>Nicole speaks to 10 year old Nicole, just like</b><b>you're speaking to me now. That's who you're</b><b>looking at. You're not looking at you. You're</b><b>looking at 10 year old Nicole. And that's when</b><b>you're in the matrix. And you have that</b><b>conversation and you help that child heal in that</b><b>conversation and feel safe. Yes. It's all about</b><b>safety that you become the person that child</b><b>needed at that time. Exactly. Right. Exactly</b><b>right. You become that person. You ask her, what</b><b>do you need to happen? Yeah. And she can say, I</b><b>need my mom to apologize to me or my need my dad</b><b>to come back and not lock the door or whatever</b><b>has to happen and you, and you, you give it to</b><b>her, you say, okay, that's going to happen. And</b><b>then you wait until it happens or what do you</b><b>need? You know, I need, I need my brother to</b><b>apologize to me. Okay. So then how does, how does</b><b>it happen? I'm not following it. So when it, so,</b><b>so if you say that's going to happen, you wait,</b><b>meaning it happens back in, it's happening then.</b><b>Like when you're with that child, it happens that</b><b>like you see it happens. So let your mom come</b><b>back and apologize to you. Like it's a</b><b>visualization thing that you're going to</b><b>visualize your mom came back in, apologize, and</b><b>now you're going to close</b><b>that chapter in your trauma.</b><b>This is, you can ask, what is your mom saying to</b><b>you? You're asking Nicole, what is your mom</b><b>saying to you? Oh my gosh, she's hugging me.</b><b>She's telling me that she loves me and she made a</b><b>big mistake and it wasn't my fault or whatever it</b><b>is. This is like deep unpacking. Deep, deep,</b><b>deep, deep, deep. This is serious. Question</b><b>packing. Now is there, I'm thinking of like a</b><b>guided mushroom psilocybin trip or a peyote or</b><b>the what's that other stuff? The ayahuasca is</b><b>that in, is that part of this at all? Or is this</b><b>more the, you're going to channel it naturally</b><b>through thoughts and tapping and it's, you know</b><b>what I'm going to know. Maybe there's a workshop</b><b>for that. I'll have to take it, but I know I</b><b>didn't take that one. But for this, for this, it</b><b>sounds like that. Yeah, no, it's tricky, but for</b><b>this, it's no, it's just you and you're going</b><b>into the matrix in your mind because this all</b><b>happened and you're not, even though you're</b><b>asking the echo, that's little you, what she</b><b>needs. It's you're not changing the memory.</b><b>You're just allowing you in that moment to get</b><b>what you actually need. So then when you come out</b><b>of the matrix, it's imprinted in you, that new</b><b>feeling of I got what I needed. I'm not harboring</b><b>whatever it is. You're healing. You're healing.</b><b>You know that your mom left you and you know that</b><b>thing actually happened. You're not like changing</b><b>your, your reality. Yeah. You, what actually</b><b>happened, but you get to feel and sense. It's a</b><b>sensory. You get to sense and feel a different,</b><b>safer solution or moment or whatever. Which is</b><b>physiological and not just psychological. You</b><b>allow someone to envision a different outcome</b><b>that they wanted to have. And then that becomes</b><b>the memory or the association, or at least an</b><b>alternative to what really happened. It's</b><b>allowing people to find heavy stuff. Yeah. It's</b><b>allowing them to find their own closure, to give</b><b>themselves their own closure when the people in</b><b>their lives maybe wouldn't, we'll never give it</b><b>to them. Right. You can, there's so many levels</b><b>to that. So many levels. So are you certified in</b><b>that? Cause you went out there and did that whole</b><b>workshop. I don't think I'm certified yet. I have</b><b>to watch like a bunch of videos, um, of more and</b><b>more and more of that work being done, and then I</b><b>will be certified. I mean, I did the workshops. I</b><b>went out there, I did the work and it had on me.</b><b>And it was amazing. I can't even imagine. It's</b><b>cool because there's things that you think about.</b><b>I'm sure everybody has like little memories that</b><b>you carry that just, they're like kind of talking</b><b>to you in the back of your head, even though</b><b>you're not consciously thinking about them every</b><b>day, or though sometimes you might be. Um, you</b><b>know, I had one and then I worked on it and I,</b><b>and I honestly haven't thought about it since</b><b>we're talking about it right now, and it would be</b><b>like a little memory that I was going to ask you</b><b>back there. If you've, has this helped you? All</b><b>right. You've gone through some shit in the last</b><b>few years. Has this helped you kind of. Well,</b><b>have you, have you used this at all for current</b><b>stuff that's happened in your life or are you not</b><b>there? Are you not ready to go back to, to deal</b><b>with that yet? I haven't used matrix on recent</b><b>stuff. Yeah. I've used it on things. Um, I don't</b><b>know, my memory when I was around 10, a memory</b><b>when I was on around 11, and I would think about</b><b>them a lot, but not so, I don't know. You know</b><b>what? Do you know what I'm saying? They call it</b><b>your Roman empire. So there was this whole thing</b><b>on social media probably about a year ago where</b><b>they say men always every day, at least once</b><b>think about the Roman empire. Every man you know,</b><b>thinks about the Roman empire, at least once a</b><b>day. Is that symbolic? No, it's just, they say</b><b>that happens. I don't, I don't know if it's</b><b>literally true, but they said in general, men</b><b>will think about the literal Roman empire that</b><b>time, history, once a day, right? So now if</b><b>there's a thing that pops up in your head, people</b><b>say, that's my Roman empire, that's my thing that</b><b>you, it's just that thing you think about. You</b><b>don't know why, but you still think about it</b><b>daily or weekly or whatever it is, it still is</b><b>there. It's your Roman empire. But I wonder</b><b>almost what you're describing. Roman empire is</b><b>more like, I don't know, this nebulous thought</b><b>about Romans. No, no, when it was, yeah. Yeah.</b><b>She's describing more like maybe some traumatic.</b><b>Yeah. I'm just, I'm just using it. Figuratively</b><b>though, I'm saying figuratively, it's her Roman</b><b>empire. I'm not saying she's thinking about the</b><b>Roman empire. I'm not suggesting that, but one's</b><b>like nebulous, like, oh yeah, it'd be cool to</b><b>live back in the Roman. Yeah, hers is personal.</b><b>Yeah. Yes. I see what you're saying, but still</b><b>that's like your, sort of the goal of this also</b><b>is, um, because of that moment, that thing that</b><b>happened or didn't happen or whatever. You have</b><b>some, you took away a belief about yourself or</b><b>about the world around you.</b><b>And we all have these beliefs. Yes. I'm terrible</b><b>at public speaking or I'm not good enough. I'm</b><b>not smart enough. I'm never going to make enough</b><b>money. I'm never going to have enough. Whatever</b><b>it is that, that drives you. Everybody has these</b><b>limiting self beliefs. I love the concept. It is</b><b>literally rewiring. Yeah. And, and it's self</b><b>care. There's your example of self care, Mary.</b><b>And I started laughing at self care. Now it's</b><b>like my, my drive. Right. Exactly. It's, it's</b><b>definitely a form. Yeah. Cause therapies is a</b><b>form of self care. And in my opinion, my opinion</b><b>only, um, this, I think this is a form of</b><b>therapy. You know, if you really take the whole</b><b>picture of it, how can it not be? Cause therapy</b><b>gets in your brain. They, they ask you questions</b><b>and have you do practices and it's, it's very</b><b>similar. So, and I think therapies of Well, like</b><b>Freud and young would be super proud of this</b><b>because they're love it. The godfathers, right?</b><b>The originators of psychoanalysis. This is that</b><b>in such an evolutionary scale of leaps and</b><b>bounds. It's a trip. How common is this, is this</b><b>relatively new, this concept, or has this been</b><b>around for a long time? I think the matrix, I</b><b>don't really know. I know that, um, I think I</b><b>want to say in the early eighties is when this</b><b>kind of started and I could be wrong, but Alina</b><b>Frank, my mentor learned from Gary Craig. And</b><b>that was, and he did that, like came up with this</b><b>thing in the eighties and it was,</b><b>let's answer your question. I want to say it was</b><b>like early eighties. And that's new. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>Um, but, but I would encourage anybody listening</b><b>who thinks this is kind of interesting, just go</b><b>for it. Take the workshop, look up, um, Alina</b><b>Frank and look up Greg Wiener. They are amazing.</b><b>And this workshop I did with them for EFT level</b><b>one and two was in June of 2023. And it took me</b><b>about a year. And then after that, um, then I</b><b>just did matrix in January of 2025. And, and</b><b>there's so much more to learn. There's so much</b><b>more to do. Yeah. I can only imagine. So if you</b><b>were going to start taking clients for this, are</b><b>you setting up a space in your new home to accept</b><b>people? Or are you going to just meet with people</b><b>virtually? Or have you thought about it? So I</b><b>have a little office in my house. I could meet</b><b>people there. Or I can meet people at their</b><b>houses or, um, I was working with a woman in Zoom</b><b>and she's in California, so it's something you</b><b>can do with Zoom. Cause yeah, I'm not tapping on</b><b>you. You're doing your own thing. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. Um, so it can totally be on Zoom. It's very</b><b>versatile. I worked with</b><b>a guy in the Philippines.</b><b>Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And Zoom. Mm-hmm. I think</b><b>that it's something that, um, cause snowball</b><b>definitely, you know, if you start getting more</b><b>and more clients and helping people,</b><b>yeah, it's the business partner, I have to figure</b><b>out how to, I probably need to get on social</b><b>media and do all that stuff that I'm not on.</b><b>Yeah. Um, yeah, but it's, it, I think for this,</b><b>it's worth getting on. Yeah. Yeah. You know, to</b><b>get, to get the word out. For me, that's the</b><b>boring part, but I got to do that part. Yeah.</b><b>Well, you've, like I said, you're really at this</b><b>point in your life now where you're kind of ready</b><b>to probably go for it. Yeah. And you focus, you</b><b>know, so you have another year before you're</b><b>certified with the, um, homeopathy.</b><b>And, um, and so you'll have that plus the tapping</b><b>plus the matrix treatment or when it helps re</b><b>imprint, re imprint, which is really what you</b><b>would do in a tapping session, like, so once you</b><b>have a couple of tapping sessions, with someone,</b><b>then they kind of know the drill with the</b><b>tapping. If there's a limiting self belief that</b><b>keeps coming up, you might need, then you would</b><b>could say, Hey, when I approach this a different</b><b>way, we could, you know, it wouldn't be something</b><b>you would just go to someone and say, Hey, I want</b><b>matrix treatment to kind of like do the tapping</b><b>and be familiar. And then, cause that's way more</b><b>intense. So you probably have to get people just</b><b>used to the whole concept of what's happening</b><b>before you take them deeper into it. Or with</b><b>them. Yeah. Yeah. There's a level of trust,</b><b>obviously. Definitely. Yeah. Have you, have your</b><b>siblings done it with you at all? Or have you</b><b>worked with your siblings? I've done tapping with</b><b>a couple of my siblings, but I've never done the</b><b>matrix. I really, I've got, I've when I, I wanted</b><b>to matrix with them. Yeah. It's super cool. I've</b><b>done it with my, I've did an exchange with one of</b><b>my fellow students that we did the workshop with</b><b>very, very cool. It's fun. And we're complete</b><b>strangers. So I think it's so exciting. I'm</b><b>excited to see where this goes for you because I</b><b>think this has so much potential because I,</b><b>because I think it, again, it could help so many</b><b>people and especially people, especially Gen Xers</b><b>who are really getting to a point where they're</b><b>unpacking their trauma. I could see this taking</b><b>off for them, but not just that, but women who</b><b>are going through divorce, like people in abusive</b><b>situations, like it can just be so healing. So</b><b>it's such a great opportunity for people. Yeah.</b><b>It really has no, no cap to it. And it really has</b><b>no, nothing's too small. Nothing's too big. You</b><b>know, it can be, I get nervous at work or I</b><b>really hate my boss. You know, I don't want to</b><b>feel like that. You know, it can be any of that</b><b>stuff. There's no, there's no problem too big or</b><b>too small. Exactly. Exactly. Now, what about with</b><b>kids? Do people do it with kids? Great with kids</b><b>and helping them with anxiety and stress. What</b><b>about with like ADHD and ADD? Has there been any</b><b>work with that? I don't, I don't know how to</b><b>speak to that. Like from a medical standpoint, I</b><b>just think that if it's, you know, everything's</b><b>connected, the mind, the body, so wherever that's</b><b>coming from, if you can tap on it or, or if</b><b>there's a result of the ADD that is undesirable</b><b>or that someone's nervous about like, Oh, every</b><b>time I go in a classroom, I started like jerking</b><b>my foot around and it embarrasses me. Like we can</b><b>tap on that, you know, and see kind of, and it</b><b>takes its own life. It takes its own path. Yeah.</b><b>I can see, I can see really helping Gen Z has a</b><b>lot of anxiety. That generation, I could see it.</b><b>The kids in their twenties right now, they get</b><b>paralyzed a lot of, not all of them, but many of</b><b>them get paralyzed with the anxiety. I could see</b><b>it being a tool for that generation too, just</b><b>with anxiety alone. For anyone. Well, I've been</b><b>thinking the, the fidget spinner things. That's a</b><b>big thing for the kids with ADHD.</b><b>It almost is a comparable, maybe the, that fidget</b><b>spinner stuff is for younger kids, cause that's</b><b>the, no, I think that I</b><b>think college students have used,</b><b>well, you might, I think you might have some of</b><b>that. I don't think I've</b><b>sat still this entire time.</b><b>We might all. So in, in this life, this</b><b>adventurous life you've been living where you've</b><b>been tackling all these different jobs and taking</b><b>all these different chances. Have you traveled?</b><b>Just to kind of recently to California and to do</b><b>the matrix. No, I really haven't traveled in the</b><b>past, I'd say the past five years. I haven't</b><b>really traveled that much. I used to travel a</b><b>lot. Where did you go when you used to travel?</b><b>Well, I used to travel when I was married. Okay.</b><b>Yeah. So we would travel the different.</b><b>Do you go to Europe? Mm hmm. What countries in</b><b>Europe have you been to? France. And then, you</b><b>know, once we went out there, then we'd tack on</b><b>the vacation, close by, go to Italy. That's one</b><b>of my favorite places to go.</b><b>And, um, England, Scotland, you</b><b>know, on trips. Do you go to Spain? No.</b><b>I went to Spain in college. Okay.</b><b>Tell you what happened to</b><b>me in Spain. No. In Spain.</b><b>Um, well, I studied abroad in college when I was</b><b>a junior, uh, my spring semester of my junior</b><b>year. I, did you guys do that? A lot of, we</b><b>didn't, I don't think our school offered it.</b><b>Okay. Yeah. They did, but I don't know. Now I</b><b>didn't, we followed the dead.</b><b>Oh, there you go.</b><b>No, no, we, we went and saw grateful that shows</b><b>us. So we, no, internationally. Did you go? No,</b><b>no, no. Okay. No, no. Like up and down the West</b><b>coast. Yeah. You know, San Francisco, but we</b><b>didn't do, we're study abroad now. No, but so you</b><b>did that your, your junior spring, my spring</b><b>semester, my junior year. Yeah. I did that. And</b><b>that was really fun. I, my parents kudos to them</b><b>for trusting me to do that and sending me out of</b><b>my way. Yeah. That was fun. And I was in Spain</b><b>and I was at a payphone trying to make a phone</b><b>call payphone. That's how a</b><b>billion years ago this was.</b><b>And my sister like had a friend and she's like,</b><b>I'll call my friend. You're in Spain. And I'm</b><b>like, who knows where they were in Spain. I'm</b><b>like, I will call them. So I did. And like, it's</b><b>a funny, I know really funny, right? And the</b><b>phone was just like beeping. It wasn't ringing.</b><b>And I was like, is this busy sign in Spain or is</b><b>it getting through? And I had taken off, you</b><b>know, as a student, so I would stay in hostels</b><b>and travel and get the rail tickets. And this is</b><b>a trick because I was based in Rome. So this was</b><b>a trip to Barcelona and I had a cross body purse</b><b>with like everything in it, my license, credit</b><b>card, my student ID, my every, I slept with this</b><b>thing under my pillow. Like it was like a body</b><b>appendage. And for some reason, it just happened</b><b>to everyone. You start doing something, you're</b><b>like half your brain's like, I shouldn't do this.</b><b>I shouldn't do this. The other path is like, just</b><b>do it. Don't be such a freak. Yeah, calm down. So</b><b>I took it off and I put it on the like the ledge</b><b>of the payphone and my friend was shoulder to</b><b>shoulder with me. And the strap was between us</b><b>and the purse was like, I</b><b>don't know, like this big.</b><b>And I'm listening and she's right there. And I</b><b>don't know how I don't know how, but I look down</b><b>and the thing is gone. It's gone. No, they're</b><b>pros over there. They are how though. They're</b><b>just pros. They're pro pickpockets. I don't know</b><b>how, but the fact that he moved this purse past</b><b>between our shoulders or between our head, like I</b><b>just don't without either of us seeing. All I</b><b>know is I'm listening to speed. I look down and I</b><b>see my purse is gone and I'm like, oh my God. And</b><b>she didn't notice either. No, she didn't notice</b><b>either. And I just like dropped the phone and I</b><b>scanned the crowd. We were near like a park area.</b><b>I think people are like walking at the drinking</b><b>fountain, throwing balls, having picnics. And I</b><b>see one guy walking quickly and guys don't walk</b><b>quickly. I just kind of lumber along. Yeah. Not</b><b>in Spain. Not in Spain. It's all chill. It's all</b><b>chill. And this guy's walking fast by himself.</b><b>And I just ran. I didn't think if I thought I</b><b>probably should have thought, but I didn't think</b><b>I just ran after him. I jumped on his back. I</b><b>brought my arms and legs around him. You did?</b><b>Yes. Like a piggyback almost. Yes, exactly. Like</b><b>that. That's true. That's true. She's like, you</b><b>don't know who you just met. Oh my gosh, it was a</b><b>gentleman. Jumped on this guy. And I didn't see</b><b>my purse. I didn't know for sure. I just. Oh, you</b><b>just saw a guy walking fast and you're like, wait</b><b>a minute. But she's from Jersey. So you knew. I</b><b>started this podcast saying I'm a Jersey girl.</b><b>Yeah. A hundred percent. That makes sense. So you</b><b>can take the girl out of Jersey. But you know the</b><b>rest. Sorry, buddy. Yeah. And that's what I said.</b><b>I said, nice try, buddy. Nice try. But like you</b><b>started yelling at this guy. And then he screamed</b><b>and he threw my purse. Oh my gosh. Oh, there it</b><b>is. And then I like got off and then I and my</b><b>friend is just, could you imagine my friend's</b><b>reaction? She was just like what happened? And</b><b>then after, then I was like shaking. I'm like,</b><b>what did I do? That was so dangerous. Oh, that's,</b><b>that's amazing. That's amazing. You did that</b><b>though. That goes along with your, how you tackle</b><b>life though, I think.</b><b>Through instinct and not thinking.</b><b>Probably. No, but you find success. You find</b><b>success. You got your bag bag. Yeah. I got my bag</b><b>bag. Could you imagine if you hadn't? That's</b><b>hilarious. Could you imagine if it wasn't the</b><b>guy? Oh, that's even better.</b><b>You could not do that nowadays. No, you could.</b><b>Yeah, absolutely. No, I don't think so. I think</b><b>people know the same cowards that were doing that</b><b>shit. That's not a manly thing to do it. Not a,</b><b>you know, yeah, I get, I don't know. Ridiculous.</b><b>I don't know. I think it'd be pretty scary. So,</b><b>and then did you have a situation in California</b><b>with someone I thought someone named Kim or</b><b>something. Yeah, Kim. So Kim was who I became</b><b>really close friends with through Bongo. Okay.</b><b>Okay. That's your, that's your good friend. And</b><b>was it something happening in California? Oh, so</b><b>speaking of Jersey girls, she and I, uh, were, we</b><b>had to, so there was a show for Bongo and we had,</b><b>we were in LA and Kim and I were the models. So</b><b>we had to, we, we were in the same hotel and</b><b>we're like, all right, let's go to the job and we</b><b>had to get gas. Yeah. So you know what they don't</b><b>do in Jersey, right? Yeah. You don't pump your</b><b>own gas. You don't pump your own gas. Yeah. And</b><b>we were living in New York, so we didn't have</b><b>cars. So we didn't, and we're</b><b>like, what do you, what do we do?</b><b>Was this the first time you'd ever been presented</b><b>with up in your own gas? I think so. Oh my gosh.</b><b>That's hilarious. And we were like, and we're</b><b>running late. It was behind. And so we went</b><b>inside to get coffee and I'm kind of like being</b><b>like, I know it. Come on, Kim, let's go. Like,</b><b>let's go relate. And she's just like, oh, and she</b><b>starts talking to the guy behind the counter. And</b><b>she's like, so nice to him. How are you? Good</b><b>morning. And I'm like, can we just get $20 on</b><b>number four? You know, I'm trying to get going</b><b>and relate and she's just smiling. Like, and so</b><b>we, I get my coffee, we get in the car, we drive</b><b>away. And then we start driving and I'm like, did</b><b>you pump the gas? Oh my gosh. She's like, did you</b><b>pump? I'm like, we didn't pump the gas. We didn't</b><b>pump the gas. Who pumped it? Nobody pumped the</b><b>gas. We had to go back. We had to go back. And</b><b>sure enough, he was so nice. Why? Because nice</b><b>Kim, instead of, you know, bitchy running late,</b><b>Mary, you know, and she's like, Oh, we paid, but</b><b>we didn't actually pump. Then he's like, no</b><b>problem. You know, he remembered her. Her. He was</b><b>like, he was like, I remember you. You're nice.</b><b>Oh, your friend is smiling. I'll cover this.</b><b>Yeah. Nice one. And I learned from her. I'm like,</b><b>I, you know, you gotta, yeah. Yeah. Don't be a</b><b>rush. And yes. Yes. Yes. But that is funny. You</b><b>guys both your first experience</b><b>and neither one of you did it.</b><b>We paid more, but that's about it. You know, it's</b><b>Jersey and Oregon are the only two states. Oregon</b><b>is that way too. No, we, I didn't pump gas. Oh,</b><b>that's great. Yeah. And then all of a sudden we</b><b>moved to Michigan. I think that's the first time</b><b>and it was completely foreign. I didn't know what</b><b>I was doing. So now I just bring a bunch of</b><b>antibacterial gel with me everywhere. Now we go</b><b>back to Jersey and we had, we were there a couple</b><b>of summers ago and the guy pumps our gas and I'm</b><b>like, do we tip them? Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, we should tip them.</b><b>Right. It feels unnatural now. Yeah. Totally. Uh,</b><b>and was there something, I feel like there was</b><b>something that happened back, um, when you were</b><b>17 with your dad and, uh, like a confrontation</b><b>with like someone that was</b><b>inappropriate or. Oh God.</b><b>Oh, she tapped that one out.</b><b>Yeah. Did you tap that one out? Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. That one was bad. That was like, yeah, I</b><b>was 17. I was a lifeguard and like, there was</b><b>somebody who like a creepy dad that was like kind</b><b>of, I guess hitting on me, but I didn't really</b><b>know he was hitting on me. Like a middle aged</b><b>dude. Only 17. Yeah. I had a little kids there</b><b>whenever. And he ended up writing me a letter,</b><b>like a 10 page, like double sided letter. Did he,</b><b>did he come to the pool a lot? Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>And, uh, and I guess my mom saw this letter and</b><b>was like, what the fuck is this? You know, my mom</b><b>like opened it and like looked at it and they</b><b>were like, okay. So is this a dad that would come</b><b>to the pool every day with his kids? Yeah. Oh my</b><b>God. And then was it like mid season? He gave you</b><b>this letter. I don't even remember. And maybe it</b><b>was the end. Maybe I was like going to college</b><b>and it was the end of the summer. I was like, I</b><b>don't know what it was. Did your dad, I don't</b><b>even think I read the thing. I was just like,</b><b>what is this? You know, did your dad confront</b><b>him? No. So it was interesting. Cause I thought</b><b>my dad would like go crazy, but my dad was so</b><b>even keel and like a gentleman and, um, they, my</b><b>parents said, you have, we're going to give you</b><b>the opportunity to deal with this. And if you</b><b>don't deal with it, then we're going to deal with</b><b>it. And, um, I was like, Oh my God, don't say</b><b>anything. This is so embarrassing. You know, like</b><b>the last thing, you know, it was, it was just a</b><b>creepy, weird, embarrassing situation in general</b><b>all around. And so I'm like, all right, I'll say</b><b>something. I'll say something. I'll say</b><b>something. And, um, my parents came to the pool</b><b>and they're like, it was like, they're eating</b><b>pizza, they're having dinner and like watching,</b><b>watching, watching, yeah, yeah. Waiting for me to</b><b>go and say like, yo, this is totally</b><b>inappropriate. And wow. Yeah. And did you know, I</b><b>think that's, I mean, that's a lot to ask of a 17</b><b>year old, but you know what, I think it was the</b><b>right thing for them to do. And I wish I would</b><b>have done it. I just, I think it's like I was</b><b>procrastinating and procrastinating and</b><b>procrastinating. I was</b><b>nervous. I'm like, you know, I was 17.</b><b>I'm basically going to go up to somebody and be</b><b>like, you're a pervert. Yeah. Yeah. You know, you</b><b>wrote me this letter and you shouldn't have</b><b>whatever. And so I didn't do it. And then, um,</b><b>next thing I know my dad's standing there talking</b><b>to this guy and. And it was done. Yeah. I don't</b><b>blame your dad. I, your dad had a lot of patience</b><b>to give you that opportunity. A lot of pain. I</b><b>know. Maybe my mom had. I was going to say, do</b><b>you think your mom talked him into that approach?</b><b>My mom probably did because, you know, as I</b><b>became older and an adult, I knew my dad more as</b><b>an adult. Yeah. He for sure would have said</b><b>something. He would have said something. Oh yeah.</b><b>You think about that though. My mom back then</b><b>that was before the internet, before social</b><b>media. Yeah. So, um, think about how easy it is</b><b>now for men like that to send stuff like, like</b><b>digitally to young girls. If this guy felt so</b><b>brazen, had all the audacity to send, give you a</b><b>10 page letter to your house, those are the type</b><b>of guys that are preying on underage girls on the</b><b>internet. And there's so many of them. Well,</b><b>these are the same guys who meet a federal agent</b><b>at an airport thinking it's a 13 year old girl.</b><b>Yeah. That's who he is. Yeah. No, it's crazy</b><b>though that it's, I think there's way more men</b><b>like that than we even comprehend. A hundred</b><b>percent. Yeah. Was that your only experience with</b><b>a situation like that? Cause you were out there</b><b>modeling and, and you know, it probably in</b><b>situations, maybe with some unsavory people,</b><b>would you say that was the worst situation? Yeah.</b><b>And probably after that, it helped you be a</b><b>little more on guard too.</b><b>Maybe. I think so, but I, yeah, I, I think so. I</b><b>think I tend to be a little more, um, I think</b><b>everyone's nice, you know, but I think living in</b><b>New York wisened me up a little bit, but then,</b><b>you know, being down here, I just feel like that</b><b>kind of went away. Yeah. Cause now I'm like a</b><b>soft, gentler version, you know, and I just, I</b><b>don't know. But no, but if it was your daughter,</b><b>that'd be different. That's where it switches to</b><b>them. Yeah. It does switch. Right. You know,</b><b>where it's like about our kids. No, you're right.</b><b>I think it goes on a lot more than we think. And</b><b>I have to be aware of it. It's just something you</b><b>don't like to think about, but it's a harsh</b><b>reality and it's something you gotta be aware of.</b><b>No, it's one of the reasons when my kids get all</b><b>of them would get social media. I would get that</b><b>social media and they would have to be friends</b><b>with me to have it so that I can just at least</b><b>have an idea what's going on. Not that I know</b><b>everything, but just to be connected to some way,</b><b>cause it's so easy to hide things right now. It's</b><b>so scary. So I do have to ask you because we're</b><b>in a similar age bracket here. Um, touching on</b><b>the topic of perimenopause and menopause.</b><b>Have you gone through any of that yet?</b><b>Not to my knowledge or had any symptoms. Do you</b><b>think? I don't think so. And do you know if your</b><b>mom, did she ever talk to you about it?</b><b>Um, my, my, I just remember my mom telling me</b><b>like she's so hot. Oh my God. It's so hot in</b><b>here. Hot. Yeah. And that was like in her</b><b>fifties. I think that's what all of our moms</b><b>would say. Yeah. There's just hot. That's all I</b><b>really remember. I don't remember anything like.</b><b>Nothing else going on and on or anything like</b><b>that. No, there was no discussion of it. No, they</b><b>didn't know. Not really. I mean, it's just</b><b>always. Yeah. No, that was it. Just that she was</b><b>hot. Yeah. And that was it. That's why the air</b><b>set for 40 degrees right now. Yeah. No, I'm just</b><b>kidding. No, but I think that one thing I think</b><b>Gen X women are doing is bringing the discussion</b><b>of menopause, premenopause to light out in the</b><b>open and also for the younger generations of</b><b>women, because it's just as big of a shift as</b><b>puberty was for us. And puberty is talked about</b><b>in school. Even young boys know to some extent</b><b>what girls go through. Get to get their period</b><b>and physically they know. Oh yeah. Um, but</b><b>menopause is not really talked about. And there's</b><b>women out there that are suffering because</b><b>there's so many symptoms, um, they, and if you</b><b>don't understand what's going on, you could feel</b><b>like you're starting to go crazy. And a lot of</b><b>women through their forties, as they hit</b><b>perimenopause into their fifties suffer because</b><b>of that lack of communication. When you say they</b><b>feel like they're going crazy, do you, do you</b><b>mean like psychological symptoms? They're</b><b>psychological symptoms. I mean, other than the</b><b>brain fog and, um, the temperature, the hot</b><b>flashes, the unexplained 20 pound weight gain,</b><b>especially around your middle, um, the thinning</b><b>of the hair, um, the muscle, eggs, frozen</b><b>shoulder. Um, but then also not being able to get</b><b>a word grasp a word, which could be related to</b><b>brain fog too, but go to say something and you,</b><b>you know, that word, but you're like, I don't</b><b>know what that word is. I'm trying to say I can</b><b>see that word. Um, but then. Emotional ups and</b><b>downs because of hormones because of the drop in</b><b>estrogen. Um, and there's a, and there's so much</b><b>more, like there's like a hundred symptoms. Uh,</b><b>and then the family, a lot of times the partner,</b><b>if she's married, has no idea what's going on, a</b><b>lot of times she doesn't know what's going on.</b><b>And, um, there's a lot of divorces that happen.</b><b>There's a lot of women that, um, commit suicide.</b><b>And so, um, I think it's on Gen X women to talk</b><b>about it so that millennial women and Gen Z</b><b>women, by the time they get there, because</b><b>doctors really, OBS don't really give it. It's</b><b>just do it's more like, uh, yeah, workout, eat</b><b>better. And that's not what it is. Um, there are</b><b>doctors who will offer HRT, um, to help, but it's</b><b>just this subject for women that's been largely</b><b>ignored and women are suffering. So it's</b><b>something that when I have someone on who's</b><b>around that age, I bring the subject up just to</b><b>see, and you aren't experiencing it yet, so you</b><b>can't speak to it. Yeah. But, um, as you're out</b><b>there living life, you know, if you encounter, if</b><b>that you start to have those experiences and not</b><b>all women feel it, there are women who go through</b><b>it and they don't have that. They went through</b><b>the shift. I've, I know women are like, I didn't,</b><b>like, I didn't feel anything. Now you are still,</b><b>you're younger than me by I</b><b>think three years. I'm 54.</b><b>Yeah. Four years. So it could still be there.</b><b>That's going to happen. But if it does talk about</b><b>it, you know what I mean? Talk about with other</b><b>women, we have to start and, and with our</b><b>daughters too, we need to talk about when you hit</b><b>this point in your life, these are the potential</b><b>changes that can happen. I think it's important</b><b>that we're part of that shift. So, and</b><b>congratulations on not having any issues yet.</b><b>But a lot of that could also be due to your</b><b>lifestyle. You live a very healthy lifestyle. I</b><b>do think diet and exercise has a lot to do with</b><b>supporting women through that and a lot of women,</b><b>um, you know, are not on a good diet or exercise</b><b>regularly. So I think that's, you've been a very</b><b>clean eater for the whole time. I've known you.</b><b>Yeah, it's interesting. I had, um, a raging bout</b><b>of, um, eczema, which I've never ever had</b><b>anything like that in my life and I had it. It's</b><b>a symptom just saying it. Oh, it is. Well, but</b><b>I'm not saying it's related to that, but it is a</b><b>symptom. I don't like, I could see that because I</b><b>think everything gets more sluggish, including</b><b>your liver. And I think this was a liver issue</b><b>that I had to like clean up my liver. And I ended</b><b>up, um, I guess cleaning up my diet, although</b><b>I've always. You eat really well. Yeah. I eat, I</b><b>eat a balanced diet. I'll say I eat everything.</b><b>There's something I don't really eat. Um, but I</b><b>don't, I think I eat pretty well. And you've</b><b>never been a big, uh, you don't consume a lot of</b><b>alcohol, I don't think. Right. Since I've known</b><b>you, I don't think you're a big drinker. I'm not</b><b>a big drinker. I mean, I guess I'm a casual</b><b>social. Yeah. Um, but when I had my, ooh, sorry,</b><b>I had my eczema. I think that, um, that is, that</b><b>was something that I cut down on a lot. Alcohol.</b><b>Yeah. Alcohol like, oh, I have wine, cooking</b><b>dinner. Oh, I have wine with it. And I, there's a</b><b>lot of crap in wine. There is like, there just</b><b>is, I thought that wine was like, oh, it's</b><b>grapes. And it's fermented those alcohol. There's</b><b>like food coloring in it. There's added sugar.</b><b>There can be whey in it. Like WHEY, there's so</b><b>much crap in wine. You really, I mean, now</b><b>there's organic wines and things, but, um, I</b><b>think that there was like, you think you're just</b><b>having a glass of wine and they're actually</b><b>putting a bunch of horrible crap in your body</b><b>that you would never opt for. Yeah. Um, and</b><b>that's why I think that it helps with my eczema.</b><b>Really stopped drinking wine basically, um, for a</b><b>while. And then I'll, yeah, yeah, totally cleared</b><b>up. Um, and now I'll drink wine again, but, um,</b><b>not, yeah, I'm not, I wouldn't say I'm a big</b><b>drink or anything like that. No, no, no. Have you</b><b>noticed as you've gotten older, your reaction to</b><b>alcohol is stronger. Like, have you ever, do you</b><b>get hungover? Have you ever gotten hungover?</b><b>Yeah. But I, I think when I had that eczema, my</b><b>liver was burdened with just too many things.</b><b>And, um, I would notice then that I would feel</b><b>horrible after just one glass of wine or after,</b><b>you know, and then after I stopped really, and</b><b>just cleared all that out and cleared out my</b><b>liver and cleared out the eczema, um, now my</b><b>tolerance is much higher because I don't, it's</b><b>not, it's the kind of the opposite way you think</b><b>it would have worked. Like you think if you don't</b><b>drink that much, you'd, you'd have a low, I</b><b>guess, I guess what I'm saying is my tolerance</b><b>for being hungover or feeling bad, you know, and</b><b>doesn't make me feel bad because I think I've</b><b>cleaned up the liver. I really think it's about</b><b>the liver. I've cleaned up the liver and so I can</b><b>process this stuff because as soon as you drink,</b><b>it's going to your liver. Yeah, yeah. 100%.</b><b>That's getting worse. Well, you're the one that</b><b>introduced me to celery juice. Yay. And that's</b><b>still as I, every morning, that's life changing.</b><b>That's medical medium, Anthony Williams. I'll</b><b>never forget when you told me about that. That</b><b>was probably like three years ago, I think. When</b><b>you think it was more than that, was it, was it</b><b>before COVID and that, and I noticed when I don't</b><b>drink celery juice that day, I noticed, I got to</b><b>get back into it. I stopped because my eczema</b><b>went away. It's when I got lazy, but it's so good</b><b>and it's, it's what you put in your body is so</b><b>important. We actually, we were out of town last</b><b>weekend and she brought celery juice. I made it</b><b>and I put it in sealed jars and I had it because</b><b>I have it in the morning. I take my thyroid meds</b><b>and then I have to wait like 45 minutes to an</b><b>hour. And then I have my celery juice on an empty</b><b>stomach. You're committed. Yeah. Changing, right?</b><b>It's, it's life changing. I would say like, cause</b><b>you've shared a lot of good health stuff with me.</b><b>And that one is one that I am so grateful for</b><b>because it's, it's life changing. I can't, I wish</b><b>everyone knew about celery juice, you know, and</b><b>at Costco, it's back organic. I wish we could</b><b>grow it more easily, Dr. I know. It is tough to</b><b>grow. It is. Costco, yeah. Has the pre trimmed</b><b>bulk organic. It's the best. It's the best. Do</b><b>you do it too, Brian? No, he did. He did. And</b><b>then you stopped. A while. You did for a while. I</b><b>typically fast in the morning. I</b><b>don't usually eat till probably noon.</b><b>So I'm just, I can't do that. Well, that was one</b><b>of the medical mediums tips not to fast so much,</b><b>but as soon as you consume fat, your liver stops</b><b>detoxing, your liver's detoxing during the night</b><b>where you're sleeping. And then as soon as you</b><b>consume fat, it has to start making bile. So it's</b><b>working hard to make this bile to digest the fat.</b><b>So if you can at least from medical medium,</b><b>Anthony William says in one of his books, if you</b><b>can not eat fat until if you're trying to detox</b><b>until 11 or 12 and you're giving your liver those</b><b>extra hours, like if you just have fruit or, you</b><b>know, you avoid any eat, but avoid something with</b><b>fat. That makes sense. That's a good little just</b><b>way to kind of extend the, um, the detoxing of</b><b>your, that your liver has been doing through that</b><b>night. Now, do you stop eating</b><b>at a certain time of the day? No.</b><b>So you'll just see, no. And actually I'll eat</b><b>whenever. Okay. See, I can't, I have to grab</b><b>stuff. I'm kind of bad. Like, and I'll just, are</b><b>you just like a grazer? Yes. It's, it's, I'd</b><b>swear that I sit down and like meal time. Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. I have to stop. I have trouble sleeping if</b><b>I eat too late. Cause my stomach's still working</b><b>or whatever. I needed to stop at a certain time.</b><b>So, but that celery juice, I, for anyone</b><b>listening, it's life changing. Check out medical</b><b>medium, Anthony Williams. But honestly, I just</b><b>drink 16 ounces of celery juice every morning and</b><b>it heals your gut, it, oh, it's so good for your</b><b>gut. Um, if you're dealing with constipation, it</b><b>will fix that immediately.</b><b>Um, it's just, and you just feel your brain feels</b><b>cleaner because the gut and the brain are</b><b>connected. And it helps keep all of that. I don't</b><b>know. I swear by it. So I can't thank you enough</b><b>for that. You're getting me back on a now. Cause</b><b>I know it's, and I think you even recommended</b><b>the, um, the juicer, which I can't remember now,</b><b>which one Hamilton maybe, I don't know. I don't</b><b>know. I probably sent you the link of the one I</b><b>got on Amazon. Yeah. Like a cheap one. That's a</b><b>trick. I'll put a link. We should put a link into</b><b>the juicer. Cause we've had it. Like bad</b><b>plastics. You got to get like a good one. Oh,</b><b>mine might have that positive. No, I PA free, but</b><b>that's it. That's what you need. Yeah. Yeah.</b><b>Yeah. But, um, our juicer is legit. Well, if you</b><b>told me about it before COVID we're going on over</b><b>probably five years, we've had that juice. So</b><b>using it almost every morning, we'll put the link</b><b>in for sure. Cause that, um, that's user. I</b><b>highly recommend. So I may start again. So you</b><b>should, you were drinking it with me and then you</b><b>stopped. You thought it maybe raised your sugars</b><b>or something. Like it did. Like I'd get a slight</b><b>sugar rush in the morning, but I don't know if</b><b>that was necessarily bad or not. I don't know. I</b><b>don't know if that's a story. No, no, it doesn't</b><b>know. Maybe that was just like a euphoric.</b><b>That's what it was. My gut, my liver sing. Yeah.</b><b>Before I asked my last question, did you have</b><b>anything we covered at all? Yeah. So where do you</b><b>see yourself in five years?</b><b>Five years. Oh my God. Should I make it an even</b><b>six and go two years, two years, two years? Yeah,</b><b>exactly. Exactly. That's what I'm calculating</b><b>now. I'm like, hmm, like gives me time to do</b><b>what? Throwing off her whole system.</b><b>It's an odd number.</b><b>I don't do odd number sickle. Um, that's so</b><b>funny. Um, I don't know five years. Oh my God.</b><b>Oh, well, something I have been thinking about</b><b>is, um, is, uh, to be an ND, to be an atropathic</b><b>doctor. I think that would be really cool. And</b><b>there's no school in Florida. So, um, in a couple</b><b>of years, my daughter will graduate high school.</b><b>So it could be an opportunity for me to go and</b><b>get that degree wherever it, I think there's one</b><b>in, um, Arizona. There's one in Chicago and a</b><b>couple of other places. I think Arizona sounds</b><b>most appealing, but that's just something I've</b><b>thought about. You know, I don't really know. Um,</b><b>if that's actually two NDs that I was just</b><b>talking to the other day or like, I would not</b><b>recommend going to ND school. Like you learn so</b><b>much more doing kind of the thing I'm doing with</b><b>the homeopathy and having a one-on-one teacher</b><b>and learning, like really dialing into the things</b><b>that you're interested in. Um, so we'll see, but</b><b>that's something that's on my reader. That's</b><b>exciting. It's interesting. There isn't a lot of</b><b>ND schools though. I mean, do you know how many</b><b>there are in the country? Well, I can tell you in</b><b>Florida and ND, you're not even considered a,</b><b>that's not considered a doctor. You're not a</b><b>doctor. Like in other States, you can be called a</b><b>doctor if you're, it's four years of medical</b><b>school, but it's just, you're studying different</b><b>things. You're not studying the pharmacological</b><b>aspect as much, even though I think they do dip</b><b>in that your herbs and homeopathy and nutrition</b><b>and different things. Right. Right. But in</b><b>Florida, you can't be called a doctor. Is that</b><b>common in a lot of the States? I think so. I</b><b>think more, more, I looked it up fairly recently.</b><b>I think that, yeah, maybe it's like half and</b><b>half, but I feel like there's more that don't</b><b>than do. Um, and that's something that I would</b><b>love to see changed in Florida. 100%, 100%. Just</b><b>gives people more options. Absolutely.</b><b>Absolutely. I think that's a great goal. It's an</b><b>exciting goal and involves, uh, some travel,</b><b>maybe a move, change, you know? So would you ever</b><b>consider living in Jersey again? Is that even,</b><b>it's not appealing to me. You know, I have to say</b><b>now that I've been in Florida, I love being near</b><b>the ocean and I love the warm weather. So, you</b><b>know, it snowed there this morning. Yes. In New</b><b>Jersey. It did. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't hear that.</b><b>Yeah. My cousin sent us a picture. It's snowed</b><b>and where in Northwest New Jersey and Sparta. I</b><b>actually got a text from a friend in Boston. It</b><b>snowed in Boston this morning. Oh, wow. Wow.</b><b>That's crazy. Yeah, it's crazy. It snowed, I</b><b>think once in April when we lived there. And I</b><b>always remember maybe March, but never it was</b><b>early. It was like April 2nd or something. This</b><b>is late. This is very late. Like it's snow. Yeah,</b><b>no, it's crazy. Well, that's like him. He, he</b><b>doesn't even want to go back ever. Like not even</b><b>to visit. He's once he left, he just, well, ever</b><b>since COVID to New York, it just isn't New York</b><b>inside. The appeal there isn't really very</b><b>attractive either. I used to love New York, but I</b><b>don't, there's not much of a draw. I think</b><b>there's hope it'll get back. I think it'll get</b><b>back to, I don't know, maybe not Giuliani days,</b><b>but I think it'll get better. I have hope. I like</b><b>to go to New Jersey at the shore, you know, in</b><b>the summer, in the summer, there's nothing like</b><b>the Jersey shore that's always going to have a</b><b>huge place in my heart. Yeah. And it's just Long</b><b>Beach Island in particular. Yeah, LBI's. LBI,</b><b>you're just in flip flops. It's so cash.</b><b>Everyone's, it's just so, it's for me that, well,</b><b>because that's where my parents lived also the</b><b>last 20 years of their life where I'd go back.</b><b>It's just like, for me, that feels like home.</b><b>Smells like home. Feels like home. Yeah. Are your</b><b>siblings still there? My brother's living in the</b><b>house. That was my parents. Okay. Yeah. So.</b><b>Do you have any siblings down here? I have two</b><b>sisters in St. Augustine. Oh, okay. Yeah. So</b><b>they're a couple hours drive away. We were just</b><b>there. Yeah. We love St. Augustine. Beautiful.</b><b>Yeah. That's become our new favorite place. Yeah.</b><b>We've gone twice this year. Yeah. It's so pretty,</b><b>right? It's beautiful. Yeah. We walked, I think</b><b>over 40, almost 40 miles over three days. Really?</b><b>Yeah. There's so much going on there. And we were</b><b>staying in old, you know, the area by the fort. A</b><b>little bit. Yeah. Yeah. So we were staying right</b><b>there and we were going out to the amphitheater.</b><b>So it's a three mile walk one way. If you go</b><b>direct, and then on our way back, we meandered</b><b>through neighborhoods and stuff. And that's</b><b>awesome town. Yeah, it is. It's cool. They have,</b><b>it's really cool. Yeah. They have everything.</b><b>They have the, the beach situation. They have</b><b>like a whole art kind of thing. They have the</b><b>historical thing. They have a lot going on there.</b><b>No, that's cool. They just don't have late night</b><b>food and they need late night food. So really?</b><b>Yeah. If they're like nine, there's nowhere to</b><b>go. Yeah. It's interesting. And we're not really</b><b>drinking a lot anymore. So the, there are bars</b><b>open, but we don't, we don't really drink a lot</b><b>anymore. So we're like, wow, I guess. What do we</b><b>do now? Yeah. This is what people that don't</b><b>drink a lot. What do they do? You order food</b><b>early. So it's in your hotel. We learned, but we</b><b>love St. Augustine. Well, I think that's a great</b><b>goal. I honestly do. And I think it goes in line</b><b>with the theme of your life of adventure, not</b><b>being scared. Not saying no until someone tells</b><b>you no. I love that. That's such a great, I hope</b><b>our listeners hear that. Don't tell yourself no.</b><b>Let someone else tell you no. It's very</b><b>liberating. It's great lesson. And, um, I'm</b><b>excited for you in this new chapter of your life</b><b>with everything that you're taking on and with</b><b>your new home. Um, I, I'm just think it's going</b><b>to be amazing. You know, you're really hitting a</b><b>prime, I think. Yeah. It feels like that. It</b><b>feels really good. Yeah. It's fun. It's exciting.</b><b>And, uh, yeah, I'm pumped up about it. Thank you.</b><b>Yeah. And there's hope for women. Definitely</b><b>after a divorce, there's a whole new life after</b><b>divorce. Definitely. You know, and that's because</b><b>for some people, they may not be able to see that</b><b>right now, but once you get through it, there's a</b><b>new beginning. Yeah. And it was, these are never</b><b>fun, but I think a good tidbit was a</b><b>collaborative. Go collaborative if you can. Yes.</b><b>Get it over done quickly. That was great advice.</b><b>Yeah. Go do don't tell yourself, no, go forward</b><b>and fight the imposter syndrome. Yeah. You know,</b><b>that didn't last long. And, and I think everybody</b><b>has that at some point, but once you get over</b><b>that and then you kind of realize it's okay to be</b><b>new at something, it's okay to not know</b><b>everything about, you know, and you just like,</b><b>let go of ego. Yeah. Cause it's ego that makes</b><b>you feel like you need to know everything. Yeah.</b><b>And once you let go of that and are like fine</b><b>being like, I don't know. Can you tell me? Yeah.</b><b>Or I need to learn. Or just judging yourself.</b><b>Yes. We're the worst. The worst. We're the worst</b><b>on ourselves. So, but thank you for sharing your</b><b>story. Thanks for listening. Yeah, very cool.</b><b>It's fascinating all the things you've done and</b><b>how courageous you've been through it all and</b><b>especially considering, you know, you came from a</b><b>quote unquote strict family, but that didn't stop</b><b>you either. You know, you right away, we're kind</b><b>of blazing your own path and continue to do so,</b><b>so I'm very impressed. So thank you. Thank you</b><b>for sharing your story. And I think you</b><b>definitely have inspired some people out there. I</b><b>know there's some listeners that can relate to</b><b>some of what you said. So, and they'll resonate</b><b>with them. So thank you. And, and hopefully we'll</b><b>have you back. And well, I don't know if you're</b><b>in Arizona, maybe you'll fly back in five years.</b><b>That'll be in five. So we'll see. I don't know. I</b><b>first, I gotta get my, maybe you guys can help me</b><b>with my social and all this stuff. Get this stuff</b><b>going. For sure. For sure. Get yourself over</b><b>there. I actually thought of some ideas we'll</b><b>talk. Yeah. Yeah. I did. Yeah. I think there's a</b><b>lot I honestly can see you having like almost</b><b>like a health center where like, cause holistic</b><b>medicine, it's, it becomes a practice that has</b><b>multiple tentacles that I think, right? There's a</b><b>lot of, a lot involved and it all ties together.</b><b>Even the yoga, do that or not. But yeah, the</b><b>tapping and all of that. I think you have such</b><b>potential to help so many people. So in that</b><b>respect, you got to get yourself out there. That</b><b>stuff is fun. There's so much to learn and it's</b><b>just, it's fun for me. So yeah, I'm going to keep</b><b>doing it. Yes, exactly. So, and thank you to our</b><b>listeners. Um, as always, please leave us any</b><b>questions or comments and we</b><b>will see you next time. Bye.</b><b>(Music)</b>